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Thanks for sharing. Curious: How did she 'force him to give up on twitter'? There's a lotta companies who've hired ticking time bombs like this. They don't ge

Thanks for sharing. Curious: How did she 'force him to give up on twitter'? There's a lotta companies who've hired ticking time bombs like this. They don't get why they were truly hired.

1024core 6y ago
It was discussed on HN a few months ago: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=23696427 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=23696427
hintymad 6y ago
Easy. Just call that person a racist, a bigot, or an oppressor without a shred of evidence. > A person: I think bias in machine learning is caused by bias in training data. > Me: Why are you ignoring all I've been saying? You're a racist. You're a white man who oppresses. I'm not going to talk to a bigot like you. Repeat this a few times, the attacked will be punished both online and offline. Justice served.
- tfehring 6y ago
  I don't think that's a fair characterization of Gebru's argument there at all. A better summary might be "You're the Chief AI Scientist at a massively influential and profitable company with billions of users and exabytes of data, you can't just throw up your hands and say 'welp, that's what the model spits out so that's what we're stuck with.'"
  - njanirudh 6y ago
    Its more like " There are difficulties on collecting data and historical reasons that leads to bias in the trained model" Other side " no you are a racist and responsible for bias due for being a white male"
    - tfehring 6y ago
      It's pretty clear that Gebru criticized LeCun for being apathetic about an obviously biased model, not because he's a white male. And again, "There are difficulties on collecting data and historical reasons that leads to bias in the trained model" is accurate, but it's still a total cop-out! There's no way Facebook would let results like [0] slide if there were money at stake - they'd get more training data, or even throw out training images of white faces, if they had to - so why is LeCun defending someone else's failure to do so? More importantly, how should that make us feel about the very real possibility of LeCun serving as an expert advisor on, say, police or other military applications of AI? Would he again just throw up his hands and say, "Well the training data consists disproportionately of black faces, so the model disproportionately implicates black people, nothing we can do about it"? [0] https://twitter.com/Chicken3gg/status/1274314622447820801 https://twitter.com/Chicken3gg/status/1274314622447820801
      - deleted 6y ago
        [deleted]
      - PrefixKitten 6y ago
        All real world data is inherently biased... Don't they teach this fact in introductory statistics? I can't imagine otherwise.
- BlueTemplar 6y ago
  "SJW"'s are racist and sexist. (AmIdoingitright?)

Thanks for sharing. Curious: How did she 'force him to give up on twitter'? There's a lotta companies who've hired ticking time bombs like this. They don't get why they were truly hired.

1024core 6y ago

It was discussed on HN a few months ago: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=23696427 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=23696427

hintymad 6y ago

Easy. Just call that person a racist, a bigot, or an oppressor without a shred of evidence. > A person: I think bias in machine learning is caused by bias in training data. > Me: Why are you ignoring all I've been saying? You're a racist. You're a white man who oppresses. I'm not going to talk to a bigot like you. Repeat this a few times, the attacked will be punished both online and offline. Justice served.

tfehring 6y ago
I don't think that's a fair characterization of Gebru's argument there at all. A better summary might be "You're the Chief AI Scientist at a massively influential and profitable company with billions of users and exabytes of data, you can't just throw up your hands and say 'welp, that's what the model spits out so that's what we're stuck with.'"
- njanirudh 6y ago
  Its more like " There are difficulties on collecting data and historical reasons that leads to bias in the trained model" Other side " no you are a racist and responsible for bias due for being a white male"
  - tfehring 6y ago
    It's pretty clear that Gebru criticized LeCun for being apathetic about an obviously biased model, not because he's a white male. And again, "There are difficulties on collecting data and historical reasons that leads to bias in the trained model" is accurate, but it's still a total cop-out! There's no way Facebook would let results like [0] slide if there were money at stake - they'd get more training data, or even throw out training images of white faces, if they had to - so why is LeCun defending someone else's failure to do so? More importantly, how should that make us feel about the very real possibility of LeCun serving as an expert advisor on, say, police or other military applications of AI? Would he again just throw up his hands and say, "Well the training data consists disproportionately of black faces, so the model disproportionately implicates black people, nothing we can do about it"? [0] https://twitter.com/Chicken3gg/status/1274314622447820801 https://twitter.com/Chicken3gg/status/1274314622447820801
    - deleted 6y ago
      [deleted]
    - PrefixKitten 6y ago
      All real world data is inherently biased... Don't they teach this fact in introductory statistics? I can't imagine otherwise.
BlueTemplar 6y ago
"SJW"'s are racist and sexist. (AmIdoingitright?)