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It's like an ugly C. It's a perfectly reasonable choice for web development, just like a Chevy Caprice is a perfectly reasonable car for a taxi service (as evi

by blunte 6y ago

It's like an ugly C. It's a perfectly reasonable choice for web development, just like a Chevy Caprice is a perfectly reasonable car for a taxi service (as evidenced by the thousands of them in NYC, still plodding along). You'd still rather ride in a Mercedes E430 taxi (long time European standard)... unless you had never experienced both, in which case you probably think the Caprice is just fine. And if you knew Ruby, Python, Java, C#, Kotlin, or better yet F#, Clojure, or Elixir, you'd most likely enjoy using one of them rather than PHP. There are three reasons to use PHP. 1. it works 2. it is well integrated with web servers 3. you can find some of the cheapest contract labor who know how to program in it (compared to other, less common/popular languages) Bonus 4. you need to extend Wordpress by writing a plugin or theme (and Wordpress is the Caprice of CMSs...)

Ayesh 6y ago
Eh, both take you from point A to point B if that's what you are looking for.
holoduke 6y ago
What a load of bolax. A language is nothing more than a hammer or a saw. PHP is just like the other languages you mentioned very mature. It's up to the developer to make good furniture. Entirely different skillset and not linked to a language. I have seen low level drivers for hardware written in PHP operating for over 15 years. I have seen JavaScript used in a medical device. You sound like that creepy negative 'you don't wanna hire' developer complaining about everything you have never worked with. A good developer generally appreciates most technologies.
- miskin 6y ago
  Nobody says it is not possible to use PHP in all the use cases you mentioned. But is PHP the best tool for those, or is it just the one closest to the hand? You definitely can do surgery with a kitchen knife instead of a scalpel, but often the long-term result would be better if a more appropriate tool was used.
- pdimitar 6y ago
  I appreciate JS and PHP but I do reach for Elixir for most of my web work because it parallelizes transparently, unlike PHP where you literally have to spin several interpreters -- separate OS processes -- and somehow coordinate through them. And this "coordination" turns out to have a lot of holes. So why not use a language that's explicitly made to coordinate between a lot of tasks easily? An experienced programmer might appreciate most tech (I certainly do and I recognize what they brought to the table) but there also comes the time to retire some of that tech because you have something that has all the benefits of the old stuff plus new goodies that make productivity objectively better -- we're not talking some fanboyism here like "I like the syntax better!", we're talking "I can make it in 2 days as opposed to 5, plus it will have less bugs on the first deployment" (which is something that statically and strongly typed languages like Rust bring to the table). I worked with PHP, with Java, with JS, some .NET, and a bunch of others. I wouldn't reach for them nowadays. I recognize that rewriting some systems might cost millions and I am sympathetic to the companies who can't just spend that much and are keeping their old giants alive and well. More power to them. But there are many situations where new and improved tech can be picked, yet people still refuse because of the fear of the unknown and because they became way too set in their ways. A lot of modern tech -- Elixir, Rust, F#, BuckleScript, Nim, Zig being a few good examples -- only lacks the network effects of Java / PHP / JS and it beats them in almost every other aspect. Inertia. Problem is always the inertia and people becoming old men in their 30s, yelling: "Back in my day <this> and <that>...!". (Hell, I've seen people being like that at 27 years old; quite sad.) So no, languages aren't just a hammer and a saw. Some languages can only be a saw ever, some can be a lame hammer and a lame screwdriver at the same time, others can only ever be a good car to transport tools from one place to another. What a "good developer" is, is a guy/girl who can use one or more of them in a team where each shines in their strong area.

by blunte 6y ago

Ayesh 6y ago

Eh, both take you from point A to point B if that's what you are looking for.

holoduke 6y ago

What a load of bolax. A language is nothing more than a hammer or a saw. PHP is just like the other languages you mentioned very mature. It's up to the developer to make good furniture. Entirely different skillset and not linked to a language. I have seen low level drivers for hardware written in PHP operating for over 15 years. I have seen JavaScript used in a medical device. You sound like that creepy negative 'you don't wanna hire' developer complaining about everything you have never worked with. A good developer generally appreciates most technologies.

miskin 6y ago
Nobody says it is not possible to use PHP in all the use cases you mentioned. But is PHP the best tool for those, or is it just the one closest to the hand? You definitely can do surgery with a kitchen knife instead of a scalpel, but often the long-term result would be better if a more appropriate tool was used.
pdimitar 6y ago
I appreciate JS and PHP but I do reach for Elixir for most of my web work because it parallelizes transparently, unlike PHP where you literally have to spin several interpreters -- separate OS processes -- and somehow coordinate through them. And this "coordination" turns out to have a lot of holes. So why not use a language that's explicitly made to coordinate between a lot of tasks easily? An experienced programmer might appreciate most tech (I certainly do and I recognize what they brought to the table) but there also comes the time to retire some of that tech because you have something that has all the benefits of the old stuff plus new goodies that make productivity objectively better -- we're not talking some fanboyism here like "I like the syntax better!", we're talking "I can make it in 2 days as opposed to 5, plus it will have less bugs on the first deployment" (which is something that statically and strongly typed languages like Rust bring to the table). I worked with PHP, with Java, with JS, some .NET, and a bunch of others. I wouldn't reach for them nowadays. I recognize that rewriting some systems might cost millions and I am sympathetic to the companies who can't just spend that much and are keeping their old giants alive and well. More power to them. But there are many situations where new and improved tech can be picked, yet people still refuse because of the fear of the unknown and because they became way too set in their ways. A lot of modern tech -- Elixir, Rust, F#, BuckleScript, Nim, Zig being a few good examples -- only lacks the network effects of Java / PHP / JS and it beats them in almost every other aspect. Inertia. Problem is always the inertia and people becoming old men in their 30s, yelling: "Back in my day <this> and <that>...!". (Hell, I've seen people being like that at 27 years old; quite sad.) So no, languages aren't just a hammer and a saw. Some languages can only be a saw ever, some can be a lame hammer and a lame screwdriver at the same time, others can only ever be a good car to transport tools from one place to another. What a "good developer" is, is a guy/girl who can use one or more of them in a team where each shines in their strong area.