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>Maybe? Again, it depends on what your definition of "best" is. If not enough people in Toronto think it's important enough to have a robust public transit syst

by alex_c 6y ago

>Maybe? Again, it depends on what your definition of "best" is. If not enough people in Toronto think it's important enough to have a robust public transit system, then it doesn't happen. I'm very confident Toronto has the resources required to complete an ambitious project if desired. >If the project isn't a good use of resources, indecision and inaction is the better outcome. I wish I shared your confidence, but this suggests otherwise: https://toronto.citynews.ca/2018/09/26/transit-the-number-1-issue-for-toronto-voters-polls-find/ https://toronto.citynews.ca/2018/09/26/transit-the-number-1-... I find it difficult to accept that this is the best outcome by any metric I can think of. >Unlike in China, these discussions already happen regularly, and the key difference between the status quo in China and the West is the decision making process, so that's where the conversation is focused. Is it? The conversation is focused on how China is authoritarian, not on how the Western (I really should say North American) decision-making process often leads to poor outcomes and stagnation when it comes to public projects. This IS getting pretty far off-topic from the actual article, so I'll stop here.

bpt3 6y ago
> I wish I shared your confidence, but this suggests otherwise: That's a pretty recent poll (on the timeline you provided in the earlier article), so maybe it's a sign that a more comprehensive transit system will be built soon. > I find it difficult to accept that this is the best outcome by any metric I can think of. It's definitely not optimal if you support public transit. The western model is more concerned with preventing tyranny than efficiency or optimal outcomes, for better or worse. This could very easily be one of the times where "worse" is the case. I'd still prefer it over an authoritarian system. > Is it? The conversation is focused on how China is authoritarian, not on how the Western (I really should say North American) decision-making process often leads to poor outcomes and stagnation when it comes to public projects. It seems to have expanded quite a bit beyond that (not between you and I, just generally), which seems pretty common for these types of topics. > This IS getting pretty far off-topic from the actual article, so I'll stop here. Fair enough, thanks for the discussion.

by alex_c 6y ago

bpt3 6y ago

> I wish I shared your confidence, but this suggests otherwise: That's a pretty recent poll (on the timeline you provided in the earlier article), so maybe it's a sign that a more comprehensive transit system will be built soon. > I find it difficult to accept that this is the best outcome by any metric I can think of. It's definitely not optimal if you support public transit. The western model is more concerned with preventing tyranny than efficiency or optimal outcomes, for better or worse. This could very easily be one of the times where "worse" is the case. I'd still prefer it over an authoritarian system. > Is it? The conversation is focused on how China is authoritarian, not on how the Western (I really should say North American) decision-making process often leads to poor outcomes and stagnation when it comes to public projects. It seems to have expanded quite a bit beyond that (not between you and I, just generally), which seems pretty common for these types of topics. > This IS getting pretty far off-topic from the actual article, so I'll stop here. Fair enough, thanks for the discussion.