5 ms·

Worth noting that COVID-19 probably triggers GBS in some people (like many infections). So maybe the vaccine triggers GBS in rare cases, but the disease appears

by rrss 6y ago

Worth noting that COVID-19 probably triggers GBS in some people (like many infections). So maybe the vaccine triggers GBS in rare cases, but the disease appears to also sometimes cause long term problems (neurological and otherwise). 1976 was potentially problematic because there was a massive immunization program because of fears of a pandemic, but H1N1 was not actually spreading. 2020 is obviously a different story. The pandemic is here.

johnisgood 6y ago
I do not want the vaccine, but it might be mandatory here in Eastern Europe. My family member was tested positive, and I lived with him, we were under quarantine. No symptoms, ever! I do not want to the vaccine, damn it.
- vkou 6y ago
  I don't want to have to be sober to drive my car on public roadways, and yet, here I am, acknowledging that I have some basic responsibility for the safety of people around me. This approach is incredibly selfish. Would you pursue it if you were held responsible for consequences of that behaviour, as drunk drivers are?
  - djsumdog 6y ago
    This is a bad argument. The two aren't comparable. Drinking a lot of alcohol and getting into a car is a choice. The intent doesn't even matter in most countries since it's a "Strict liability" crime. The government forcing you to take an injection is literally not your choice. Not to mention, we know drunk driving impairs people and increases risk. There are tons of studies that show that (they also show sleep deprivation is worse than alcohol for driving, but that's not illegal ... probably because it's not measurable, or it's hard to gauge intent). This vaccine has been rushed through the process with zero long-term Longitudinal studies. A drug company can yell 95% effective all they want, but the fact is, this is a HUGE unknown. The vast majority of normal scientists in other fields cannot do this research themselves and there aren't even any published papers yet we can look at. This is a bad argument. You want some more bad arguments? Look at the Buck SCOTUS decision which lead to forced serialization, or the SCOUTS decision that lead to Japanese internment camps. You know what those two decisions were dependent on? Jacobson. The vaccine case.
    - dragonwriter 6y ago
      > Drinking a lot of alcohol and getting into a car is a choice. Not taking a vaccine and interacting with other people is also a choice. > they also show sleep deprivation is worse than alcohol for driving, but that's not illegal Drowsy driving is difficult to prove, but generally held to be within the coverage of reckless driving laws. Some jurisdictions have expressly included coverage of it, as well, at least in the context of establishing the necessary illegality in vehicular homicide statutes (NJ and Arkansas.)
      - johnisgood 6y ago
        Taking a rushed vaccine with God knows what long-term effects is not going to be a choice. Have fun with it. You are playing Russian roulette that I do not wish to play. In majority of the cases COVID-19 is not lethal at all, there should be no mandatory vaccines, especially not when we have no knowledge of its long-term effects and so on and so on. If you want you can take the Chinese or Russian vaccine. I do not want to. Anecdotal: my grandmother (over 70) has been in contact with 4 COVID-19 positive people. She developed no symptoms. I think this is way too overblown. She has been in contact with many old people, too. No symptoms. > Apr 2, 2020: Asymptomatic transmission refers to transmission of the virus from a person, who does not develop symptoms. There are few reports of laboratory-confirmed cases who are truly asymptomatic, and to date, there has been no documented asymptomatic transmission. Any news on this? Down-voter: I literally quoted https://www.who.int/docs/default-source/coronaviruse/situation-reports/20200402-sitrep-73-covid-19.pdf?sfvrsn=5ae25bc7_2 https://www.who.int/docs/default-source/coronaviruse/situati.... If you have news on it, say so instead of down-voting. I want to know how likely it is for asymptomatic people to spread the virus. I swear, I will keep checking the responses because I am curious how likely it is that people will catch it from me, excluding the fact that I do not leave the house for weeks (I work remotely).
        teh_infallible 6y ago
        You can’t argue with propaganda. Questioning vaccine safety on a “big tech” forum is wrongthink.
  - fuzxi 6y ago
    That's a poor analogy. Remaining sober doesn't have potential negative side effects unless you're already addicted to alcohol/benzos. The fact is that the COVID vaccines, as with any medicine, will have side effects, and some of those side effects may be life-altering. There are valid concerns about the vaccines and these effects that cannot simply be brushed off as anti-vax nonsense.
  - johnisgood 6y ago
    > This is false when it comes to the COVID-19 vaccines under development. They do not—and are not meant to—prevent people from contracting and spreading the virus. They only reduce the symptoms. This does not help herd immunity (other than perhaps allowing the virus to spread faster, I guess). Some other HN-er said this. If this is true, then it should be my decision. Since I have been through it without symptoms, I am supposedly immune for 6 months, but even after that, I do not really care. I care about it personally as much as I care about the flu. I have not vaccinated myself against the flu in years. Let it be my decision, please. I am not an anti-vaxxer, but when it comes to the COVID-19 vaccine, I am a bit wary. I do not mind tested vaccines that have been around for decades and have been extensively researched and are pretty known to be safe.
imesh 6y ago
As someone who had GBS and was put into a coma at 16. I'm very uneasy about the vaccine, but I also don't want COVID. I'm likely going to end up taking the vaccine as soon as it's available and hoping GBS doesn't happen again, just so I can go back to my life ASAP. Depends on how the risk of GBS with the vaccine compares with the risk of GBS from COVID.

by rrss 6y ago

johnisgood 6y ago

I do not want the vaccine, but it might be mandatory here in Eastern Europe. My family member was tested positive, and I lived with him, we were under quarantine. No symptoms, ever! I do not want to the vaccine, damn it.

vkou 6y ago
I don't want to have to be sober to drive my car on public roadways, and yet, here I am, acknowledging that I have some basic responsibility for the safety of people around me. This approach is incredibly selfish. Would you pursue it if you were held responsible for consequences of that behaviour, as drunk drivers are?
- djsumdog 6y ago
  This is a bad argument. The two aren't comparable. Drinking a lot of alcohol and getting into a car is a choice. The intent doesn't even matter in most countries since it's a "Strict liability" crime. The government forcing you to take an injection is literally not your choice. Not to mention, we know drunk driving impairs people and increases risk. There are tons of studies that show that (they also show sleep deprivation is worse than alcohol for driving, but that's not illegal ... probably because it's not measurable, or it's hard to gauge intent). This vaccine has been rushed through the process with zero long-term Longitudinal studies. A drug company can yell 95% effective all they want, but the fact is, this is a HUGE unknown. The vast majority of normal scientists in other fields cannot do this research themselves and there aren't even any published papers yet we can look at. This is a bad argument. You want some more bad arguments? Look at the Buck SCOTUS decision which lead to forced serialization, or the SCOUTS decision that lead to Japanese internment camps. You know what those two decisions were dependent on? Jacobson. The vaccine case.
  - dragonwriter 6y ago
    > Drinking a lot of alcohol and getting into a car is a choice. Not taking a vaccine and interacting with other people is also a choice. > they also show sleep deprivation is worse than alcohol for driving, but that's not illegal Drowsy driving is difficult to prove, but generally held to be within the coverage of reckless driving laws. Some jurisdictions have expressly included coverage of it, as well, at least in the context of establishing the necessary illegality in vehicular homicide statutes (NJ and Arkansas.)
    - johnisgood 6y ago
      Taking a rushed vaccine with God knows what long-term effects is not going to be a choice. Have fun with it. You are playing Russian roulette that I do not wish to play. In majority of the cases COVID-19 is not lethal at all, there should be no mandatory vaccines, especially not when we have no knowledge of its long-term effects and so on and so on. If you want you can take the Chinese or Russian vaccine. I do not want to. Anecdotal: my grandmother (over 70) has been in contact with 4 COVID-19 positive people. She developed no symptoms. I think this is way too overblown. She has been in contact with many old people, too. No symptoms. > Apr 2, 2020: Asymptomatic transmission refers to transmission of the virus from a person, who does not develop symptoms. There are few reports of laboratory-confirmed cases who are truly asymptomatic, and to date, there has been no documented asymptomatic transmission. Any news on this? Down-voter: I literally quoted https://www.who.int/docs/default-source/coronaviruse/situation-reports/20200402-sitrep-73-covid-19.pdf?sfvrsn=5ae25bc7_2 https://www.who.int/docs/default-source/coronaviruse/situati.... If you have news on it, say so instead of down-voting. I want to know how likely it is for asymptomatic people to spread the virus. I swear, I will keep checking the responses because I am curious how likely it is that people will catch it from me, excluding the fact that I do not leave the house for weeks (I work remotely).
      - teh_infallible 6y ago
        You can’t argue with propaganda. Questioning vaccine safety on a “big tech” forum is wrongthink.
- fuzxi 6y ago
  That's a poor analogy. Remaining sober doesn't have potential negative side effects unless you're already addicted to alcohol/benzos. The fact is that the COVID vaccines, as with any medicine, will have side effects, and some of those side effects may be life-altering. There are valid concerns about the vaccines and these effects that cannot simply be brushed off as anti-vax nonsense.
- johnisgood 6y ago
  > This is false when it comes to the COVID-19 vaccines under development. They do not—and are not meant to—prevent people from contracting and spreading the virus. They only reduce the symptoms. This does not help herd immunity (other than perhaps allowing the virus to spread faster, I guess). Some other HN-er said this. If this is true, then it should be my decision. Since I have been through it without symptoms, I am supposedly immune for 6 months, but even after that, I do not really care. I care about it personally as much as I care about the flu. I have not vaccinated myself against the flu in years. Let it be my decision, please. I am not an anti-vaxxer, but when it comes to the COVID-19 vaccine, I am a bit wary. I do not mind tested vaccines that have been around for decades and have been extensively researched and are pretty known to be safe.

imesh 6y ago

As someone who had GBS and was put into a coma at 16. I'm very uneasy about the vaccine, but I also don't want COVID. I'm likely going to end up taking the vaccine as soon as it's available and hoping GBS doesn't happen again, just so I can go back to my life ASAP. Depends on how the risk of GBS with the vaccine compares with the risk of GBS from COVID.