5 ms·

It's considerably more difficult than Python, people just get misled by the similar syntax. The advanced features that you're mentioning aren't optional in Juli

by st1x7 6y ago

It's considerably more difficult than Python, people just get misled by the similar syntax. The advanced features that you're mentioning aren't optional in Julia, especially if you care about performance.

dnautics 6y ago
But you don't care about performance with Julia. You just write your thing. Then you complain to the community that it's slow, and they optimize it for you! Only half kidding.
adamnemecek 6y ago
Which part of Julia is difficult?
- xiphias2 6y ago
  For me it was understanding the type unification rules. After a long time I read the original dissertation papers, and only that was the time when I finally understood what method is being called why at what point. While method dispatch is the most interesting part of Julia, it's the most complex as well.
- st1x7 6y ago
  Compared to Python? Just about everything starting from simple things like how to create a simple data structure, how to convert a variable to a different type, how to understand any error message that you get, how to open a file or modify a visualisation and extending all the way up to overarching concepts like the typing system, importing foreign code and managing dependencies.
  - adamnemecek 6y ago
    How is making a structure in Julia harder than in python?
  - jonniedie 6y ago
    A simple data structure: struct ASimpleDataStructure a b end Convert a variable to a different type: x = 1 x = Float64(x) Open a file: open(“a_file.txt”) Import foreign code: using PyCall so = pyimport(“scipy.optimize”) so.newton(x -> cos(x) - x, 1)
    - adamnemecek 6y ago
      Yeah defining a strict in python would be more lines.
    - st1x7 6y ago
      This really isn't constructive. - I had none of those examples in mind (for example by foreign code I was referring to code written in a different project, not to using a different language). No, I don't need you to give me code snippets on how to do my actual list. - Obviously Julia can do everything that Python can. And most of it will look ergonomic, short and simple. The difficult part isn't whether the language can do it once you know how, it's how quickly you can get to figuring it out when you don't know it. - So what makes the small things difficult is really the mix of unhelpful error messages and the limited resources online. This is my overall point - if you take someone who hasn't written code in either Python or Julia, give them access to online search and ask them to complete almost any task, they'll do it faster and with less effort in Python.

by st1x7 6y ago

dnautics 6y ago

But you don't care about performance with Julia. You just write your thing. Then you complain to the community that it's slow, and they optimize it for you! Only half kidding.

adamnemecek 6y ago

Which part of Julia is difficult?

xiphias2 6y ago
For me it was understanding the type unification rules. After a long time I read the original dissertation papers, and only that was the time when I finally understood what method is being called why at what point. While method dispatch is the most interesting part of Julia, it's the most complex as well.
st1x7 6y ago
Compared to Python? Just about everything starting from simple things like how to create a simple data structure, how to convert a variable to a different type, how to understand any error message that you get, how to open a file or modify a visualisation and extending all the way up to overarching concepts like the typing system, importing foreign code and managing dependencies.
- adamnemecek 6y ago
  How is making a structure in Julia harder than in python?
- jonniedie 6y ago
  A simple data structure: struct ASimpleDataStructure a b end Convert a variable to a different type: x = 1 x = Float64(x) Open a file: open(“a_file.txt”) Import foreign code: using PyCall so = pyimport(“scipy.optimize”) so.newton(x -> cos(x) - x, 1)
  - adamnemecek 6y ago
    Yeah defining a strict in python would be more lines.
  - st1x7 6y ago
    This really isn't constructive. - I had none of those examples in mind (for example by foreign code I was referring to code written in a different project, not to using a different language). No, I don't need you to give me code snippets on how to do my actual list. - Obviously Julia can do everything that Python can. And most of it will look ergonomic, short and simple. The difficult part isn't whether the language can do it once you know how, it's how quickly you can get to figuring it out when you don't know it. - So what makes the small things difficult is really the mix of unhelpful error messages and the limited resources online. This is my overall point - if you take someone who hasn't written code in either Python or Julia, give them access to online search and ask them to complete almost any task, they'll do it faster and with less effort in Python.