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It’s interesting the use of the aggressive language “revenge“ And “retaliatory” which seems to have a negative charge. I wonder if it is due to the culture of C

It’s interesting the use of the aggressive language “revenge“ And “retaliatory” which seems to have a negative charge. I wonder if it is due to the culture of China, its communist leaning, or something deeper that looks at personal leisure time as a bad thing.

barkingcat 6y ago
You might have misunderstood. The term that is being described here is kind of like a meme-phrase/word. Like in the article said, it was likely invented years ago, probably in the Chinese version of twitter/social media/etc. The revenge and retaliatory terms are more subversive than negative. The retaliation is against losing control of your own time. The revenge is against your corporate-master, your boss, the pointy-haired boss, the Communist political officer, "the Man", late stage capitalism - whatever you want to call it I don't think the sentiment is limited to China and communism, etc. and that's why this article struck a chord enough for it to get onto hnews. That said, the subversive nature of the wording is very very Chinese. Not just Communist Chinese, but this type of subversive back-talk has been alive for many many generations since the imperial days, where you had to talk in circles in order to not be executed.
throwaway2245 6y ago
Considering that these are English language words, I don't think a linguistic analysis is going to give you insight into Chinese culture. The exact choice of words used in translation is largely going to be a reflection of the English language. Also, what's the equivalent in other languages? In English, wouldn't we say 'self-sabotage'?
kerblang 6y ago
Interesting that the most downvoted comment is the only one concerned with China instead of "Yeah but let's talk about me!"... China has a culture of "labor" as the symbol of one's personal worth, and this ties into the Maoist/Communist ideal of empowering _labor_. In America, "idleness" might be the _reward_ of labor, or even a _kind_ of labor: thinking, imagining, talking, creating ideas themselves: "idle" labor. In America, physical labor is respected, but probably more _rewarded_ is one's talent for idle labor, especially nowadays. In China, the labor is its own reward, and idleness is "evil" - maybe nobody believes that anymore, but they go along with it. Furthermore, China knows that ideas are easy to steal, but labor isn't.
- prower 6y ago
  If your government/culture looks at you like an ant, of course it'll judge you only by your net output. Other than a "thank god I'm not Chinese", I'm not sure what other discussions one could have without going onto politics and being considered and anti-chinese. I love chinese and japanese culture, but their particular work ethic is total nightmare and wrong on every level and needs to disappear as soon as possible. EDIT: I'm currently sleep deprived (of course...) so I'm sorry if this comes out harsher than needed. 2ND EDIT: Other than that, this is not even a work ethic/culture problem, is that many current working practices are not suitable for human survival beyond basic functions. It doesn't change if you're chinese or not.
- throwaway201103 6y ago
  My view of the American perspective is "be as idle as you please, but don't ask me to pay for it."

barkingcat 6y ago

You might have misunderstood. The term that is being described here is kind of like a meme-phrase/word. Like in the article said, it was likely invented years ago, probably in the Chinese version of twitter/social media/etc. The revenge and retaliatory terms are more subversive than negative. The retaliation is against losing control of your own time. The revenge is against your corporate-master, your boss, the pointy-haired boss, the Communist political officer, "the Man", late stage capitalism - whatever you want to call it I don't think the sentiment is limited to China and communism, etc. and that's why this article struck a chord enough for it to get onto hnews. That said, the subversive nature of the wording is very very Chinese. Not just Communist Chinese, but this type of subversive back-talk has been alive for many many generations since the imperial days, where you had to talk in circles in order to not be executed.

throwaway2245 6y ago

Considering that these are English language words, I don't think a linguistic analysis is going to give you insight into Chinese culture. The exact choice of words used in translation is largely going to be a reflection of the English language. Also, what's the equivalent in other languages? In English, wouldn't we say 'self-sabotage'?

kerblang 6y ago

Interesting that the most downvoted comment is the only one concerned with China instead of "Yeah but let's talk about me!"... China has a culture of "labor" as the symbol of one's personal worth, and this ties into the Maoist/Communist ideal of empowering _labor_. In America, "idleness" might be the _reward_ of labor, or even a _kind_ of labor: thinking, imagining, talking, creating ideas themselves: "idle" labor. In America, physical labor is respected, but probably more _rewarded_ is one's talent for idle labor, especially nowadays. In China, the labor is its own reward, and idleness is "evil" - maybe nobody believes that anymore, but they go along with it. Furthermore, China knows that ideas are easy to steal, but labor isn't.

prower 6y ago
If your government/culture looks at you like an ant, of course it'll judge you only by your net output. Other than a "thank god I'm not Chinese", I'm not sure what other discussions one could have without going onto politics and being considered and anti-chinese. I love chinese and japanese culture, but their particular work ethic is total nightmare and wrong on every level and needs to disappear as soon as possible. EDIT: I'm currently sleep deprived (of course...) so I'm sorry if this comes out harsher than needed. 2ND EDIT: Other than that, this is not even a work ethic/culture problem, is that many current working practices are not suitable for human survival beyond basic functions. It doesn't change if you're chinese or not.
throwaway201103 6y ago
My view of the American perspective is "be as idle as you please, but don't ask me to pay for it."