11 ms·

I must admit I was completely ignorant of the effects of Vitamin D deficiency on common illnesses such as the flu as well as how unbelievably common that defici

by Exmoor 6y ago

I must admit I was completely ignorant of the effects of Vitamin D deficiency on common illnesses such as the flu as well as how unbelievably common that deficiency is for people living in much of the northern hemisphere. Will it cure COVID19? No. But do I think there's a decent chance it will improve my outcome while simultaneously improving my ability to fight off other viruses. I am honestly completely shocked that we haven't seen governments and the media increasing people's awareness of this issue.

Zenst 6y ago
> I am honestly completely shocked that we haven't seen governments and the media increasing people's awareness of this issue. Same, and in the UK at least we got this: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-55108613 https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-55108613 I remember this back from April and lots of evidence back then: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GCSXNGc7pfs https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GCSXNGc7pfs
KLexpat 6y ago
The problem is that vitamin D absorption is one of those things linked to ethnicity. It is very basic and undisputed science that lower melanin in skin = higher vitamin D absorption. No European educational institution or government wants to publicise research highlighting that ethnic groups indigenous to the northern hemisphere are more suited to the natural environment they are endemic too, and less likely to have vitamin D problems. Of course, the Vitamin D deficiency in people unsuited to non-indigenous European residents will naturally disadvantage them over time in nature. https://www.longdom.org/open-access/the-skin-melanin-an-inhibitor-of-vitamind3-biosynthesis-with-special-emphasis-with-structure-of-skin-a-mini-review.pdf https://www.longdom.org/open-access/the-skin-melanin-an-inhi... https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4272394/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4272394/ To give balance to reinforce that i'm purely speaking from a scientific-rational viewpoint, in Australia the government is trying to discourage people from being in the sun at all due to Australia (primarily european ethnic) having one of the highest rates of skin cancer in the world, due to also not being suited to their natural environment. https://www.cancer.org.au/cancer-information/types-of-cancer/skin-cancer https://www.cancer.org.au/cancer-information/types-of-cancer... "the incidence of skin cancer is one of the highest in the world, two to three times the rates in Canada, the US and the UK." The USA approach is quite different though - pills for everyone! Buy your vitamin D plastic chips and watch the stock market go up!
- Mountain_Skies 6y ago
  Wonder if there is also a connection with the declining popularity of cow's milk, which is typically fortified with vitamins A & D. In primary school, cow's milk have become less common due to increased awareness that different ethnic groups have different tolerances for lactose. Unfortunately, it appears the groups that would benefit the most from more vitamin D are also the ones most likely to be lactose intolerant, and thus not drinking the milk fortified with vitamin D.
  - opan 6y ago
    You can find plant milk and even orange juice with vitamin D added.
- stordoff 6y ago
  FWIW, I've seen the NHS mention it quite a few times. Example: > People with dark skin, such as those of African, African-Caribbean or south Asian origin, will need to spend longer in the sun to produce the same amount of vitamin D as someone with lighter skin. https://www.nhs.uk/live-well/healthy-body/how-to-get-vitamin-d-from-sunlight/ https://www.nhs.uk/live-well/healthy-body/how-to-get-vitamin...
  - westwing 6y ago
    It can be mentioned as a footnote, because it is scientific fact. However, given the vastly higher death rates among people with darker skin, it should be shouted from the rooftops. Unfortunately, this would put into question the narrative that anything but systemic racism may be to blame. Furthermore, pointing out that people with darker skin are not adapted to live up north could easily be misconstrued as an anti-immigration stance. “Far-right quacks are pushing unproven treatment for COVID” makes for a juicy headline. So, who wants to be the first to put their reputation on the line?
    - outworlder 6y ago
      > Furthermore, pointing out that people with darker skin are not adapted to live up north could easily be misconstrued as an anti-immigration stance. True. That can easily happen. Reason enough to not push that angle, at least not directly. There are other ways of phrasing that. Besides, for humans, there's no longer such a thing as "being adapted" to the environment, at least not in that limited sense. This is not an Earth versus Mars thing, it's just a matter of latitude. If natural abilities were such a big factor, we wouldn't need clothes in Norway or Canada to survive in those places, in winter. But we do. Plus heating. Humans are not "adapted" to live in all environments on Earth, at least not without tools, which includes clothing. So, if your skin is light and you are in an area with high insolation, cover up more and try to spend less time in the sun. Add some sunscreen too. If the skin is darker, do the opposite. Add some supplements as needed. Done. Adapted to the environment.
orangecat 6y ago
Yes. I won't be surprised if we eventually determine that advocating Vitamin D supplements would have been one of the most beneficial strategies we could have implemented. But it's a "drug", and therefore "unethical" to recommend without years of studies even though we know that it has effectively zero risk.
- colechristensen 6y ago
  You can overdose on vitamin D and it can have significant side effects. More or less anything that can have a positive effect on your health can have a negative effect if done wrong. If something has no possible negative effects it probably doesn’t do anything at all.
  - mixmastamyk 6y ago
    You can overdose on water but we still tell folks to drink several glasses a day, because most people don't get enough. That a tiny few are sensitive or go nuts with it shouldn't stop helping everyone else.
- nucleardog 6y ago
  I don’t think that’s really the blocker here. Vitamin D supplementation is very low risk and the risks are well known. I’ve seen at least one study that I can recall saying exactly that—the correlation is there and vitamin D is safe and basically risk free so we should be supplementing it in at least the at-risk population immediately.
  - wolco2 6y ago
    Vitamin D taken orally needs to bind with Calcium or Mg. Sun Lamps may be a better option for the at risk group.
    - mixmastamyk 6y ago
      Elderly can't produce vitamin D.
jberryman 6y ago
> I am honestly completely shocked that we haven't seen governments and the media increasing people's awareness of this issue. The fact that it hasn't been picked up by journalists and public health officials should rather be reason for you to be skeptical of early research cherry-picked by random programmers on the internet... the same people that were blowing up HN with hydroxychloroquine stories just a few months ago.
- Exmoor 6y ago
  When I was reading it in the spring I was skeptical for exactly those reasons, but it quickly became clear with even the smallest bit of research that it was well accepted the Vitamin D deficiency was linked with worsened effects from common viruses and that the vast majority of people in my region were deficient. Most of the people I've seen mentioning it recently have been medical and scientists on other sites.
  - mixmastamyk 6y ago
    Haven't been sick more than a day at a time since reading about it around 2010.
- wolco2 6y ago
  In fairness what the media deeds important and accepts as truth is as cherry-picked by some random newsroom editor. That's why you see things like the Iraq war everyday on tv and then never again. People are still blowing themselves up over there. There is always a bigger story with a greater theme that uses daily news stories to paint a broader picture. People who seek out truth themselves are more likely to find it.

by Exmoor 6y ago

Zenst 6y ago

> I am honestly completely shocked that we haven't seen governments and the media increasing people's awareness of this issue. Same, and in the UK at least we got this: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-55108613 https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-55108613 I remember this back from April and lots of evidence back then: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GCSXNGc7pfs https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GCSXNGc7pfs

KLexpat 6y ago

The problem is that vitamin D absorption is one of those things linked to ethnicity. It is very basic and undisputed science that lower melanin in skin = higher vitamin D absorption. No European educational institution or government wants to publicise research highlighting that ethnic groups indigenous to the northern hemisphere are more suited to the natural environment they are endemic too, and less likely to have vitamin D problems. Of course, the Vitamin D deficiency in people unsuited to non-indigenous European residents will naturally disadvantage them over time in nature. https://www.longdom.org/open-access/the-skin-melanin-an-inhibitor-of-vitamind3-biosynthesis-with-special-emphasis-with-structure-of-skin-a-mini-review.pdf https://www.longdom.org/open-access/the-skin-melanin-an-inhi... https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4272394/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4272394/ To give balance to reinforce that i'm purely speaking from a scientific-rational viewpoint, in Australia the government is trying to discourage people from being in the sun at all due to Australia (primarily european ethnic) having one of the highest rates of skin cancer in the world, due to also not being suited to their natural environment. https://www.cancer.org.au/cancer-information/types-of-cancer/skin-cancer https://www.cancer.org.au/cancer-information/types-of-cancer... "the incidence of skin cancer is one of the highest in the world, two to three times the rates in Canada, the US and the UK." The USA approach is quite different though - pills for everyone! Buy your vitamin D plastic chips and watch the stock market go up!

Mountain_Skies 6y ago
Wonder if there is also a connection with the declining popularity of cow's milk, which is typically fortified with vitamins A & D. In primary school, cow's milk have become less common due to increased awareness that different ethnic groups have different tolerances for lactose. Unfortunately, it appears the groups that would benefit the most from more vitamin D are also the ones most likely to be lactose intolerant, and thus not drinking the milk fortified with vitamin D.
- opan 6y ago
  You can find plant milk and even orange juice with vitamin D added.
stordoff 6y ago
FWIW, I've seen the NHS mention it quite a few times. Example: > People with dark skin, such as those of African, African-Caribbean or south Asian origin, will need to spend longer in the sun to produce the same amount of vitamin D as someone with lighter skin. https://www.nhs.uk/live-well/healthy-body/how-to-get-vitamin-d-from-sunlight/ https://www.nhs.uk/live-well/healthy-body/how-to-get-vitamin...
- westwing 6y ago
  It can be mentioned as a footnote, because it is scientific fact. However, given the vastly higher death rates among people with darker skin, it should be shouted from the rooftops. Unfortunately, this would put into question the narrative that anything but systemic racism may be to blame. Furthermore, pointing out that people with darker skin are not adapted to live up north could easily be misconstrued as an anti-immigration stance. “Far-right quacks are pushing unproven treatment for COVID” makes for a juicy headline. So, who wants to be the first to put their reputation on the line?
  - outworlder 6y ago
    > Furthermore, pointing out that people with darker skin are not adapted to live up north could easily be misconstrued as an anti-immigration stance. True. That can easily happen. Reason enough to not push that angle, at least not directly. There are other ways of phrasing that. Besides, for humans, there's no longer such a thing as "being adapted" to the environment, at least not in that limited sense. This is not an Earth versus Mars thing, it's just a matter of latitude. If natural abilities were such a big factor, we wouldn't need clothes in Norway or Canada to survive in those places, in winter. But we do. Plus heating. Humans are not "adapted" to live in all environments on Earth, at least not without tools, which includes clothing. So, if your skin is light and you are in an area with high insolation, cover up more and try to spend less time in the sun. Add some sunscreen too. If the skin is darker, do the opposite. Add some supplements as needed. Done. Adapted to the environment.

orangecat 6y ago

Yes. I won't be surprised if we eventually determine that advocating Vitamin D supplements would have been one of the most beneficial strategies we could have implemented. But it's a "drug", and therefore "unethical" to recommend without years of studies even though we know that it has effectively zero risk.

colechristensen 6y ago
You can overdose on vitamin D and it can have significant side effects. More or less anything that can have a positive effect on your health can have a negative effect if done wrong. If something has no possible negative effects it probably doesn’t do anything at all.
- mixmastamyk 6y ago
  You can overdose on water but we still tell folks to drink several glasses a day, because most people don't get enough. That a tiny few are sensitive or go nuts with it shouldn't stop helping everyone else.
nucleardog 6y ago
I don’t think that’s really the blocker here. Vitamin D supplementation is very low risk and the risks are well known. I’ve seen at least one study that I can recall saying exactly that—the correlation is there and vitamin D is safe and basically risk free so we should be supplementing it in at least the at-risk population immediately.
- wolco2 6y ago
  Vitamin D taken orally needs to bind with Calcium or Mg. Sun Lamps may be a better option for the at risk group.
  - mixmastamyk 6y ago
    Elderly can't produce vitamin D.

jberryman 6y ago

> I am honestly completely shocked that we haven't seen governments and the media increasing people's awareness of this issue. The fact that it hasn't been picked up by journalists and public health officials should rather be reason for you to be skeptical of early research cherry-picked by random programmers on the internet... the same people that were blowing up HN with hydroxychloroquine stories just a few months ago.

Exmoor 6y ago
When I was reading it in the spring I was skeptical for exactly those reasons, but it quickly became clear with even the smallest bit of research that it was well accepted the Vitamin D deficiency was linked with worsened effects from common viruses and that the vast majority of people in my region were deficient. Most of the people I've seen mentioning it recently have been medical and scientists on other sites.
- mixmastamyk 6y ago
  Haven't been sick more than a day at a time since reading about it around 2010.
wolco2 6y ago
In fairness what the media deeds important and accepts as truth is as cherry-picked by some random newsroom editor. That's why you see things like the Iraq war everyday on tv and then never again. People are still blowing themselves up over there. There is always a bigger story with a greater theme that uses daily news stories to paint a broader picture. People who seek out truth themselves are more likely to find it.