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I don't have much hope left in India. We deserve the people we vote for. India has chosen fundamentalism and fascism. The worst thing is that despite all data

I don't have much hope left in India. We deserve the people we vote for. India has chosen fundamentalism and fascism. The worst thing is that despite all data and stats around their failures, the current regime enjoys immense popularity. The opposition is irrelevant, the media and news portals are completely subservient to the regime. And even the SC, once the champions of our democracy are pretty much a laughing stock for whom issuing contempt cases over twitter posts to comedians is too much important. India finally has single issue voters. And this issue isn't poverty, corruption, progress or anything like that. It's just Hindutva. This religious fundamentalism is what will finally end the great Indian experiment.

lazy_nerd 6y ago
If people in US can be misled by fake news, India stood little chance. Facebook and WhatsApp have been used effectively to brainwash the general public in India. As Barack Obama described in his new book 'Promised Land', the chances of democracy surviving in a multi-ethnic, multi-religious poor country like India was precarious at best. BJP and RSS has effectively made sure that democracy dies in India
- kevin_thibedeau 6y ago
  This is a problem in all cultures where proscriptivist philosophies have enough currency that people will actively oppose general purpose freedom. Democracy requires a willingness to tolerate differences of opinion and behavior.
- quantummkv 6y ago
  > BJP and RSS has effectively made sure that democracy dies in India That's a weird statement to make, considering that the current PM is a self-made man without any old money, family name or ivy league connections. Infact, most of the high ranking people in his cabinet are self-made men like him. The current Home Minister of India for example started his career as a polling-booth level canvasser in the party. If a poor self-made man rising to the top in free and fair elections (results accepted by everyone) is a murder of democracy, then you need to find the correct definition of democracy.
  - kranner 6y ago
    There are many examples of fascists who were self-made men. It doesn’t have anything to do with democracy at all.
  - rainingcatndogs 6y ago
    > Infact, most of the high ranking people in his cabinet are self-made men like him. We hear a lot about how the current government is less corrupt and less dynastic. But their actions say otherwise[1][2][3]. [1] https://m.thewire.in/article/politics/bjp-congress-political-dynasties-lok-sabha https://m.thewire.in/article/politics/bjp-congress-political... [2] https://www.thenewsminute.com/article/electoral-bonds-controversy-all-you-need-know-10-points-112763 https://www.thenewsminute.com/article/electoral-bonds-contro... [3] https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arrest_of_Kafeel_Khan https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arrest_of_Kafeel_Khan
haltingproblem 6y ago
I will start with a quibble to make a point. India has a republican form of govt just like the US not a Democracy. Republican forms of governance have existed in India for over 2000+ years [1]. They will survive whatever foreboding you have real or imagined that will befall the "great indian experiment" which is not an experiment except for those whose history starts in 1947. Hinduism has been present in India for over 3000 years. Hindu kingdoms welcomed Jews (~900BC), Christians (52 AD), Zoorastrians (600AD), Muslims (550 AD), Armenians (1500AD) who have lived and prospered without molestation for millenia because of the pluralistic nature of Hinduism. Zoorastrians who were wiped out in Persia (Iran) by their own kith and kin who converted have prospered in India to the point that this tiny minority (less than 100k) leads several of the top-20 conglomerates (e.g. Tata). Hinduism is not just tolerant but pluralistic because it acknowledges multiple paths to god unlike any other religion. Pluralism >>> Tolerance. Multi-religious, multi-ethnic India will survive because of Hinduism not in-spite of it. Case in point, the neighboring states of Pakistan and Bangladesh are both Islamic and the non-muslim population has dwindled precipitously from 20% in 1947 to less than 10% and they are well on their way to becoming 99% Muslim the next couple decades. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ga%E1%B9%87a_sangha https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ga%E1%B9%87a_sangha
- fakedang 6y ago
  Indonesia is a highly diverse Muslim majority country, with a political system inspired by Indian secularist values, and it has seen much less conflict than India has in recent years. All of your assertions fall flat. To give an example from the Muslim side, Jewish refugees escaping from Spanish repression in the 1550s-1600s escaped to the Ottoman Empire, where they were welcomed and shepherded into the bureaucracy. Hinduism and it's openness may have been responsible for letting people live in harmony for close to 3 millennia, but what we see is not the Hinduism of those times, but a rabid bastardization of it, akin to Islamic radicalization we see in Pakistan and Afghanistan.
  - th3iedkid 6y ago
    Hmm Indonesia may not be the best of examples ? https://www.theweek.co.uk/103382/is-indonesia-becoming-a-sharia-state https://www.theweek.co.uk/103382/is-indonesia-becoming-a-sha...

lazy_nerd 6y ago

If people in US can be misled by fake news, India stood little chance. Facebook and WhatsApp have been used effectively to brainwash the general public in India. As Barack Obama described in his new book 'Promised Land', the chances of democracy surviving in a multi-ethnic, multi-religious poor country like India was precarious at best. BJP and RSS has effectively made sure that democracy dies in India

kevin_thibedeau 6y ago
This is a problem in all cultures where proscriptivist philosophies have enough currency that people will actively oppose general purpose freedom. Democracy requires a willingness to tolerate differences of opinion and behavior.
quantummkv 6y ago
> BJP and RSS has effectively made sure that democracy dies in India That's a weird statement to make, considering that the current PM is a self-made man without any old money, family name or ivy league connections. Infact, most of the high ranking people in his cabinet are self-made men like him. The current Home Minister of India for example started his career as a polling-booth level canvasser in the party. If a poor self-made man rising to the top in free and fair elections (results accepted by everyone) is a murder of democracy, then you need to find the correct definition of democracy.
- kranner 6y ago
  There are many examples of fascists who were self-made men. It doesn’t have anything to do with democracy at all.
- rainingcatndogs 6y ago
  > Infact, most of the high ranking people in his cabinet are self-made men like him. We hear a lot about how the current government is less corrupt and less dynastic. But their actions say otherwise[1][2][3]. [1] https://m.thewire.in/article/politics/bjp-congress-political-dynasties-lok-sabha https://m.thewire.in/article/politics/bjp-congress-political... [2] https://www.thenewsminute.com/article/electoral-bonds-controversy-all-you-need-know-10-points-112763 https://www.thenewsminute.com/article/electoral-bonds-contro... [3] https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arrest_of_Kafeel_Khan https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arrest_of_Kafeel_Khan

haltingproblem 6y ago

I will start with a quibble to make a point. India has a republican form of govt just like the US not a Democracy. Republican forms of governance have existed in India for over 2000+ years [1]. They will survive whatever foreboding you have real or imagined that will befall the "great indian experiment" which is not an experiment except for those whose history starts in 1947. Hinduism has been present in India for over 3000 years. Hindu kingdoms welcomed Jews (~900BC), Christians (52 AD), Zoorastrians (600AD), Muslims (550 AD), Armenians (1500AD) who have lived and prospered without molestation for millenia because of the pluralistic nature of Hinduism. Zoorastrians who were wiped out in Persia (Iran) by their own kith and kin who converted have prospered in India to the point that this tiny minority (less than 100k) leads several of the top-20 conglomerates (e.g. Tata). Hinduism is not just tolerant but pluralistic because it acknowledges multiple paths to god unlike any other religion. Pluralism >>> Tolerance. Multi-religious, multi-ethnic India will survive because of Hinduism not in-spite of it. Case in point, the neighboring states of Pakistan and Bangladesh are both Islamic and the non-muslim population has dwindled precipitously from 20% in 1947 to less than 10% and they are well on their way to becoming 99% Muslim the next couple decades. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ga%E1%B9%87a_sangha https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ga%E1%B9%87a_sangha

fakedang 6y ago
Indonesia is a highly diverse Muslim majority country, with a political system inspired by Indian secularist values, and it has seen much less conflict than India has in recent years. All of your assertions fall flat. To give an example from the Muslim side, Jewish refugees escaping from Spanish repression in the 1550s-1600s escaped to the Ottoman Empire, where they were welcomed and shepherded into the bureaucracy. Hinduism and it's openness may have been responsible for letting people live in harmony for close to 3 millennia, but what we see is not the Hinduism of those times, but a rabid bastardization of it, akin to Islamic radicalization we see in Pakistan and Afghanistan.
- th3iedkid 6y ago
  Hmm Indonesia may not be the best of examples ? https://www.theweek.co.uk/103382/is-indonesia-becoming-a-sharia-state https://www.theweek.co.uk/103382/is-indonesia-becoming-a-sha...