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Note: not all companies do this, most companies I meet do. Maybe I'm meeting the wrong companies. Here's my original comment: Well, the flip side is. Do you h

Note: not all companies do this, most companies I meet do. Maybe I'm meeting the wrong companies. Here's my original comment: Well, the flip side is. Do you have experience with AWS? Not really, but I've known Linux for years, have done stuff on Heroku, Digital Ocean, my own servers, hacked boxes and IBM Bluemix, but no AWS. Sorry, we rejected you because you have no experience with AWS. So to be honest, I've been looking into it, because apparently a lot of Dutch (not all) are too short-sighted to see that I've done development and am able to figure it out, or have transferable knowledge (fun fact/example: in part via HN articles that showed how to load balancers [0]). Also on the money side, it's not that bad. It's $150 for an exam. I think by reading docs and watching this video [1]. It'll be possible to get. Everything I mentioned here is also true for pentesting as I've experienced something similar there. Now that you've heard me complain, I am actually for hire ;-) I'm language agnostic, most experience with NodeJS/ReactJS, junior pentesting as second skill, I'm at my best as a 50% programmer / 50% anything else <-- pentester may be included in the second 50%, or: marketing, business analyst, UX, I'm open-minded and willing to learn. If no company is hiring me by the first of January and all my applications are dead in the water, I'm starting something for myself. [0] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=21490731 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=21490731 [1] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RrKRN9zRBWs&t=32838s&ab_channel=freeCodeCamp.org https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RrKRN9zRBWs&t=32838s&ab_chan...

tj-teej 6y ago
I think this is a great point and the economics of the job come into play too... A lot of the initial challenge in interviewing is proving you can meet a certain bar to get your foot in the door for an interview. And $150 to prove that you can do a 100K+ /year job seems like a pretty rational investment
- mettamage 6y ago
  I'm from NL, so it's at best 50K. Though with the current USD/EUR, I guess that's not bad at all.
Agreed99 6y ago
Terraform or an AWS SDK are free Read up and study the individual use cases for each service, sure Write some IAC targeting the AWS APIs. If the person can otherwise talk tech concepts and it’s simply a matter of using a different cloud provider, spending free time making something is a more interesting signal to me than chasing the sunk cost
krimpenrik 6y ago
What are you interested starting? Dutchie currently in australia saving to start my own thing (relocating cheap country), looking for a cofounder. Would love to discuss. riekus at the proton provider.
krimpenrik 6y ago
Dutchie here (currently in australia) also into WHM and meditation. Planning to startup in February, want to discuss? Riekus at proton mail.
makstaks 6y ago
I don't doubt your technical skills, this comment is just to help you see the side of the employer. They don't have time to onboard someone on AWS, they need someone to be able to speak "AWS" out of the gate and contribute immediately. General knowledge isn't helpful, when you need to be able to fine tune each AWS specific services.
- rfoo 6y ago
  The problem is, one with transferable skills can get themselves to "speak AWS" in maybe a few hours, once they know exactly what they are going to use (or what needs to be done).
  - mettamage 6y ago
    I think you and the comment above lay out both sides of the argument pretty succinctly.
  - scarface74 6y ago
    Those “skills” are only transferable if all you plan to do is spin up a few VMs. Have you looked at all of the different services that AWS as well Azure and GCP offers above just hosting services? Anyone who comes to any cloud provider with that mentality actually is worse than someone who has no experience. That’s just as bad as someone who models a schema for a database meant for analytics the same way that model a database meant for transactions and wonders why it isn’t performant.
    - rfoo 6y ago
      > Have you looked at all of the different services that AWS as well Azure and GCP offers above just hosting services? I have checked their huge product offerings a few times when I needed something I know they must have, and used that, like AWS Batch and AWS SQS. As for "all of the different services". No, I haven't, but I can, and I will do that, on demand. My point is exactly that I don't want to sink huge time into reading their documentations for something I may never use. And I don't believe it is correct to prefer candidates who did that.
scarface74 6y ago
AWS is more than a bunch of servers. AWS has over 160 services. Saying that you have experience with Heroku and DO as an argument for why AWS shouldn’t be a problem is exactly the reason I wouldn’t hire someone without AWS experience.

tj-teej 6y ago

I think this is a great point and the economics of the job come into play too... A lot of the initial challenge in interviewing is proving you can meet a certain bar to get your foot in the door for an interview. And $150 to prove that you can do a 100K+ /year job seems like a pretty rational investment

mettamage 6y ago
I'm from NL, so it's at best 50K. Though with the current USD/EUR, I guess that's not bad at all.

Agreed99 6y ago

Terraform or an AWS SDK are free Read up and study the individual use cases for each service, sure Write some IAC targeting the AWS APIs. If the person can otherwise talk tech concepts and it’s simply a matter of using a different cloud provider, spending free time making something is a more interesting signal to me than chasing the sunk cost

krimpenrik 6y ago

What are you interested starting? Dutchie currently in australia saving to start my own thing (relocating cheap country), looking for a cofounder. Would love to discuss. riekus at the proton provider.

krimpenrik 6y ago

Dutchie here (currently in australia) also into WHM and meditation. Planning to startup in February, want to discuss? Riekus at proton mail.

makstaks 6y ago

I don't doubt your technical skills, this comment is just to help you see the side of the employer. They don't have time to onboard someone on AWS, they need someone to be able to speak "AWS" out of the gate and contribute immediately. General knowledge isn't helpful, when you need to be able to fine tune each AWS specific services.

rfoo 6y ago
The problem is, one with transferable skills can get themselves to "speak AWS" in maybe a few hours, once they know exactly what they are going to use (or what needs to be done).
- mettamage 6y ago
  I think you and the comment above lay out both sides of the argument pretty succinctly.
- scarface74 6y ago
  Those “skills” are only transferable if all you plan to do is spin up a few VMs. Have you looked at all of the different services that AWS as well Azure and GCP offers above just hosting services? Anyone who comes to any cloud provider with that mentality actually is worse than someone who has no experience. That’s just as bad as someone who models a schema for a database meant for analytics the same way that model a database meant for transactions and wonders why it isn’t performant.
  - rfoo 6y ago
    > Have you looked at all of the different services that AWS as well Azure and GCP offers above just hosting services? I have checked their huge product offerings a few times when I needed something I know they must have, and used that, like AWS Batch and AWS SQS. As for "all of the different services". No, I haven't, but I can, and I will do that, on demand. My point is exactly that I don't want to sink huge time into reading their documentations for something I may never use. And I don't believe it is correct to prefer candidates who did that.

scarface74 6y ago

AWS is more than a bunch of servers. AWS has over 160 services. Saying that you have experience with Heroku and DO as an argument for why AWS shouldn’t be a problem is exactly the reason I wouldn’t hire someone without AWS experience.