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I would assume more loyal than to Chinese startups. As far as I understand China is not a very immigrant friendly country. "Successful applicants are required

I would assume more loyal than to Chinese startups. As far as I understand China is not a very immigrant friendly country. "Successful applicants are required to renounce any foreign nationalities they have.[46] Naturalization is exceptionally rare in mainland China; there were only 1,448 naturalized persons reported in the 2010 census[47] out of the country's total population of 1.34 billion.[48] "

varispeed 6y ago
You don't need Chinese citizenship to work in China also likely China will offer special terms to engineers willing to relocate.
- formerly_proven 6y ago
  They do.
- PakG1 6y ago
  https://www.scmp.com/tech/policy/article/3023635/shenzhen-needs-attract-overseas-talent-fuel-greater-bay-areas-hi-tech https://www.scmp.com/tech/policy/article/3023635/shenzhen-ne... That programme offers one-off subsidies, ranging from 800,000 yuan (US$113,488) to 1.5 million yuan, in addition to welfare packages covering family members, rental allowances and medical care. More than 96 per cent of the talents recruited under the Peacock Plan holds a doctorate, and 94 per cent are Chinese returnees. Shenzhen has also pledged to extend tax breaks to top overseas and local talent, which could be as low as 15 per cent of a person’s annual income compared with as high as 45 per cent previously, under China’s progressive taxation system. To date, the city has been helping develop at least 10 laboratories in collaboration with Nobel laureates involved in natural sciences. Nine of these have been completed as of June this year. Shenzhen’s hi-tech companies are also sparing no efforts in wooing talent with high pay. Last month, Huawei announced plans to lure gifted new recruits with “top-notch” salaries.
  - varispeed 6y ago
    Some western countries are approaching thresholds like 45% for specialist income. For example in the UK after recent changes to IR35, an engineer will likely have to pay about 54% of tax assuming he or she gets paid market rates and the client will declare them to be deemed employees to be safe. If China could match western rates, but added tax exemptions on top, plus located the sites somewhere warm with good amenities, they could attract good people without even trying much.
    - Bayart 6y ago
      The problem is being paid in a currency that's worthless outside of China and can't be converted back to anything serious. It's fine for Chinese expatriates who went abroad for better money, but I can't see the rest being too interested.
      - MacsHeadroom 6y ago
        That's ridiculous. CNY is as easily converted as USD, if not more easily.
        Bayart 6y ago
        Duh, of course CNY is easily traded to other currencies on the Forex markets, China's starving for reserves. But they're actively preventing money from getting _out_ of China, in particular said reserves. If you're making money in China, it's going to stay in China until you jump through a lot of hoops.
        PakG1 6y ago
        I work in China. I wire money out of China on a regular basis to my home account in Canada. Have to give copies of tax forms and a copy of my contract to the bank, but that's about it. Other than that, it's the same as wiring money from Canada to any other country. There is a limit each year, but I've never been able to hit it. And a bunch of my foreign colleagues have half of their salary automatically deposited in USD accounts in their home country. Not me, but the point is that there are options.
legolas2412 6y ago
And usa isn't particularly immigrant friendly to employment based immigration, specially for those from India. Out of 500k green cards every year, only 15k are for eb1,2,3 employment based immigration, with country of birth based limitations on top!
- kamaal 6y ago
  As an Indian, I can say Indians will go anywhere. Gulf has way more harsher visa conditions, with no citizenship path and yet Indians flock to the Gulf. It is crazy to think that people won't sell their services for money, because of loyalty or whatever. For the common man, their own career is what they care about. And for a good reason, especially in a country where every wants to hoard money at any cost- No one's going to miss out on an opportunity of this kind.
mytailorisrich 6y ago
> As far as I understand China is not a very immigrant friendly country. China is very flexible. There may be difficulties in getting citizenship (which is another issue, really), but for work visas to foreign talents, which are sponsored by local companies, this is simply a matter of applying in order to get one.
- kube-system 6y ago
  Being “immigrant friendly” consists of more than issuing a visa.
  - mytailorisrich 6y ago
    They are very friendly to foreign talents. A lot of misconceptions and FUD here. And I write that as someone who spent 3 years living in China and working for a JV. If you want to emigrate there permanently this may be different but realistically this is not the topic of this discussion, which is more about highly educated people finding opportunities in China.

varispeed 6y ago

You don't need Chinese citizenship to work in China also likely China will offer special terms to engineers willing to relocate.

formerly_proven 6y ago
They do.
PakG1 6y ago
https://www.scmp.com/tech/policy/article/3023635/shenzhen-needs-attract-overseas-talent-fuel-greater-bay-areas-hi-tech https://www.scmp.com/tech/policy/article/3023635/shenzhen-ne... That programme offers one-off subsidies, ranging from 800,000 yuan (US$113,488) to 1.5 million yuan, in addition to welfare packages covering family members, rental allowances and medical care. More than 96 per cent of the talents recruited under the Peacock Plan holds a doctorate, and 94 per cent are Chinese returnees. Shenzhen has also pledged to extend tax breaks to top overseas and local talent, which could be as low as 15 per cent of a person’s annual income compared with as high as 45 per cent previously, under China’s progressive taxation system. To date, the city has been helping develop at least 10 laboratories in collaboration with Nobel laureates involved in natural sciences. Nine of these have been completed as of June this year. Shenzhen’s hi-tech companies are also sparing no efforts in wooing talent with high pay. Last month, Huawei announced plans to lure gifted new recruits with “top-notch” salaries.
- varispeed 6y ago
  Some western countries are approaching thresholds like 45% for specialist income. For example in the UK after recent changes to IR35, an engineer will likely have to pay about 54% of tax assuming he or she gets paid market rates and the client will declare them to be deemed employees to be safe. If China could match western rates, but added tax exemptions on top, plus located the sites somewhere warm with good amenities, they could attract good people without even trying much.
  - Bayart 6y ago
    The problem is being paid in a currency that's worthless outside of China and can't be converted back to anything serious. It's fine for Chinese expatriates who went abroad for better money, but I can't see the rest being too interested.
    - MacsHeadroom 6y ago
      That's ridiculous. CNY is as easily converted as USD, if not more easily.
      - Bayart 6y ago
        Duh, of course CNY is easily traded to other currencies on the Forex markets, China's starving for reserves. But they're actively preventing money from getting _out_ of China, in particular said reserves. If you're making money in China, it's going to stay in China until you jump through a lot of hoops.
        PakG1 6y ago
        I work in China. I wire money out of China on a regular basis to my home account in Canada. Have to give copies of tax forms and a copy of my contract to the bank, but that's about it. Other than that, it's the same as wiring money from Canada to any other country. There is a limit each year, but I've never been able to hit it. And a bunch of my foreign colleagues have half of their salary automatically deposited in USD accounts in their home country. Not me, but the point is that there are options.

legolas2412 6y ago

And usa isn't particularly immigrant friendly to employment based immigration, specially for those from India. Out of 500k green cards every year, only 15k are for eb1,2,3 employment based immigration, with country of birth based limitations on top!

kamaal 6y ago
As an Indian, I can say Indians will go anywhere. Gulf has way more harsher visa conditions, with no citizenship path and yet Indians flock to the Gulf. It is crazy to think that people won't sell their services for money, because of loyalty or whatever. For the common man, their own career is what they care about. And for a good reason, especially in a country where every wants to hoard money at any cost- No one's going to miss out on an opportunity of this kind.

mytailorisrich 6y ago

> As far as I understand China is not a very immigrant friendly country. China is very flexible. There may be difficulties in getting citizenship (which is another issue, really), but for work visas to foreign talents, which are sponsored by local companies, this is simply a matter of applying in order to get one.

kube-system 6y ago
Being “immigrant friendly” consists of more than issuing a visa.
- mytailorisrich 6y ago
  They are very friendly to foreign talents. A lot of misconceptions and FUD here. And I write that as someone who spent 3 years living in China and working for a JV. If you want to emigrate there permanently this may be different but realistically this is not the topic of this discussion, which is more about highly educated people finding opportunities in China.