6 ms·

> Now liberals view censorship as a good thing, because it’s used predominantly against conservatives. This is such a misleading statement that it needs a disc

> Now liberals view censorship as a good thing, because it’s used predominantly against conservatives. This is such a misleading statement that it needs a disclaimer.

censorthis 6y ago
This is widely known: https://nypost.com/2020/11/18/democrats-use-big-tech-hearings-to-demand-more-censorship/?utm_source=url_sitebuttons&utm_medium=site%20buttons&utm_campaign=site%20buttons https://nypost.com/2020/11/18/democrats-use-big-tech-hearing... https://www.pewresearch.org/internet/2020/08/19/most-americans-think-social-media-sites-censor-political-viewpoints/ https://www.pewresearch.org/internet/2020/08/19/most-america...
- BrianOnHN 6y ago
  What is widely known?
- boomboomsubban 6y ago
  Your first source describes some members of Congress scolding the CEO of Facebook and Twitter, and the second is an opinion poll. Neither would even be strong sources showing a censorship event happened, they don't even attempt a comparison between conservatives and liberal censorship targets.
newen 6y ago
It’s what I see everywhere on the internet now. It doesn’t seem misleading at all.
censorthis 6y ago
Oh the irony, you have flagged a post you do not agree with on a thread about censorship.
- carapace 6y ago
  Don't do that. If you're gonna come on HN and pontificate at least try to keep the level of discourse up, eh? - - - - FWIW I'm left-leaning (by US standards) and I'm concerned about the increasingly censorious actions of left-leaning (again by US standards) mainstream media. E.g. the editorial that Sen. Cotton wrote and the blowback from publishing it seemed really sketchy. My hope is that we see the moderate Left and moderate Right come together and form a new political party around common ground like free speech and fiscal responsibility.
  - cambalache 6y ago
    > My hope is that we see the moderate Left and moderate Right come together and form a new political party around common ground like free speech and fiscal responsibility. That already exists, it is called the Democratic party. The moderate right won, people like Biden, Pelosi or Warren, the moderate left (AOC, Sanders, etc) played second fiddle. The tension between the 2 groups is clear and if it werent for a common enemy (Trump/GOP) they would split in a second.
    - carapace 6y ago
      > That already exists, it is called the Democratic party. I don't see a lot of conservatives and right-moderates who want to distance themselves from the Tea Party/Trumpists flocking to the Democrats though. > moderate right won, people like Biden, Pelosi or Warren (FWIW, by US standards those are Left politicians.) Yeah but only barely. None of them are wildly popular are they? > the moderate left (AOC, Sanders, etc) (FWIW, by US standards those are extreme Left politicians.) But those folks aren't "second fiddle", they're sops: distractions to keep the Left's equivalent of the Tea Party from becoming a real political force. America is run by the rich, for the rich, and they do pretty well for themselves. I'm not even talking about gathering real political power (right OR left), just having less sturm und drang and more stability. We've got serious problems on the stove (climate, disease, etc.) that are going to take some concerted effort to tackle, eh?
eiji 6y ago
More and more very highly esteemed journalists, not pundits, are starting to voice their concerns about this more and more publicly. At the same rate they are being censored. I wouldn't be surprised if Snowden gets a pardon before inauguration. Imagine that. How the tables turn.
- BrianOnHN 6y ago
  > more very highly esteemed journalists Can you give us some examples/names?
  - eiji 6y ago
    Greenwald, Snowden, Matt Taibbi, Lee Fang, Aaron Maté, Max Blumenthal, Bret Weinstein, ... None of these can be called right-wing or conservatives. I'm not even mentioning people like Rogan. All of them are aware or actual targets of the censoring.
    - BrianOnHN 6y ago
      So what you're saying is that these people: > Greenwald, Snowden, Matt Taibbi, Lee Fang, Aaron Maté, Max Blumenthal, Bret Weinstein, ... Would agree with your previous statement: > Now liberals view censorship as a good thing, because it’s used predominantly against conservatives. Is that true?
      - deleted 6y ago
        [deleted]
  - sul_tasto 6y ago
    https://harpers.org/a-letter-on-justice-and-open-debate/ https://harpers.org/a-letter-on-justice-and-open-debate/
jackfoxy 6y ago
There is a direct intellectual line of descent from classical liberals to 1960s liberals to the woke vocal elitists dominating tech culture, academia, and corporate media today. But liberal is no longer a good noun to represent them.
- francisofascii 6y ago
  Anecdotally I see this in work online chats, with the younger liberals totally supporting censorship and firing people for tweets. Where the "older" liberals are saying no, that's not right.
free_rms 6y ago
Maybe hacker news should forcibly insert a modal saying that they don't think it's true, and make you click through that to display the objectionable content, like twitter does. Can't have people thinking there's censorship out there.
- cbozeman 6y ago
  Or they - where "they" is "every social media platform ever" can just not do a goddamned thing, and I'll make up my own fucking mind. This viewpoint that people need or want shit to be labelled for them is the most disgusting, paternalistic, anti-freedom bullshit to disgrace America in recent memory. Too many of these fucking people, not just in tech, but also in politics, have this viewpoint of "nudging people into better patterns", etc. My best friend, a smart man, but by no means the smartest of my friends once said something that resonated with me so strongly I doubt I'll ever forget it: "The problem with freedom is what other people do with it." Turns out people don't always do what you want, and that's the "true" price of freedom. Tolerating other people's stupidity.
  - free_rms 6y ago
    Guess I fell afoul of Poe's law on that one.
deleted 6y ago
[deleted]

> Now liberals view censorship as a good thing, because it’s used predominantly against conservatives. This is such a misleading statement that it needs a disclaimer.

censorthis 6y ago

This is widely known: https://nypost.com/2020/11/18/democrats-use-big-tech-hearings-to-demand-more-censorship/?utm_source=url_sitebuttons&utm_medium=site%20buttons&utm_campaign=site%20buttons https://nypost.com/2020/11/18/democrats-use-big-tech-hearing... https://www.pewresearch.org/internet/2020/08/19/most-americans-think-social-media-sites-censor-political-viewpoints/ https://www.pewresearch.org/internet/2020/08/19/most-america...

BrianOnHN 6y ago
What is widely known?
boomboomsubban 6y ago
Your first source describes some members of Congress scolding the CEO of Facebook and Twitter, and the second is an opinion poll. Neither would even be strong sources showing a censorship event happened, they don't even attempt a comparison between conservatives and liberal censorship targets.

newen 6y ago

It’s what I see everywhere on the internet now. It doesn’t seem misleading at all.

censorthis 6y ago

Oh the irony, you have flagged a post you do not agree with on a thread about censorship.

carapace 6y ago
Don't do that. If you're gonna come on HN and pontificate at least try to keep the level of discourse up, eh? - - - - FWIW I'm left-leaning (by US standards) and I'm concerned about the increasingly censorious actions of left-leaning (again by US standards) mainstream media. E.g. the editorial that Sen. Cotton wrote and the blowback from publishing it seemed really sketchy. My hope is that we see the moderate Left and moderate Right come together and form a new political party around common ground like free speech and fiscal responsibility.
- cambalache 6y ago
  > My hope is that we see the moderate Left and moderate Right come together and form a new political party around common ground like free speech and fiscal responsibility. That already exists, it is called the Democratic party. The moderate right won, people like Biden, Pelosi or Warren, the moderate left (AOC, Sanders, etc) played second fiddle. The tension between the 2 groups is clear and if it werent for a common enemy (Trump/GOP) they would split in a second.
  - carapace 6y ago
    > That already exists, it is called the Democratic party. I don't see a lot of conservatives and right-moderates who want to distance themselves from the Tea Party/Trumpists flocking to the Democrats though. > moderate right won, people like Biden, Pelosi or Warren (FWIW, by US standards those are Left politicians.) Yeah but only barely. None of them are wildly popular are they? > the moderate left (AOC, Sanders, etc) (FWIW, by US standards those are extreme Left politicians.) But those folks aren't "second fiddle", they're sops: distractions to keep the Left's equivalent of the Tea Party from becoming a real political force. America is run by the rich, for the rich, and they do pretty well for themselves. I'm not even talking about gathering real political power (right OR left), just having less sturm und drang and more stability. We've got serious problems on the stove (climate, disease, etc.) that are going to take some concerted effort to tackle, eh?

eiji 6y ago

More and more very highly esteemed journalists, not pundits, are starting to voice their concerns about this more and more publicly. At the same rate they are being censored. I wouldn't be surprised if Snowden gets a pardon before inauguration. Imagine that. How the tables turn.

BrianOnHN 6y ago
> more very highly esteemed journalists Can you give us some examples/names?
- eiji 6y ago
  Greenwald, Snowden, Matt Taibbi, Lee Fang, Aaron Maté, Max Blumenthal, Bret Weinstein, ... None of these can be called right-wing or conservatives. I'm not even mentioning people like Rogan. All of them are aware or actual targets of the censoring.
  - BrianOnHN 6y ago
    So what you're saying is that these people: > Greenwald, Snowden, Matt Taibbi, Lee Fang, Aaron Maté, Max Blumenthal, Bret Weinstein, ... Would agree with your previous statement: > Now liberals view censorship as a good thing, because it’s used predominantly against conservatives. Is that true?
    - deleted 6y ago
      [deleted]
- sul_tasto 6y ago
  https://harpers.org/a-letter-on-justice-and-open-debate/ https://harpers.org/a-letter-on-justice-and-open-debate/

jackfoxy 6y ago

There is a direct intellectual line of descent from classical liberals to 1960s liberals to the woke vocal elitists dominating tech culture, academia, and corporate media today. But liberal is no longer a good noun to represent them.

francisofascii 6y ago
Anecdotally I see this in work online chats, with the younger liberals totally supporting censorship and firing people for tweets. Where the "older" liberals are saying no, that's not right.

free_rms 6y ago

Maybe hacker news should forcibly insert a modal saying that they don't think it's true, and make you click through that to display the objectionable content, like twitter does. Can't have people thinking there's censorship out there.

cbozeman 6y ago
Or they - where "they" is "every social media platform ever" can just not do a goddamned thing, and I'll make up my own fucking mind. This viewpoint that people need or want shit to be labelled for them is the most disgusting, paternalistic, anti-freedom bullshit to disgrace America in recent memory. Too many of these fucking people, not just in tech, but also in politics, have this viewpoint of "nudging people into better patterns", etc. My best friend, a smart man, but by no means the smartest of my friends once said something that resonated with me so strongly I doubt I'll ever forget it: "The problem with freedom is what other people do with it." Turns out people don't always do what you want, and that's the "true" price of freedom. Tolerating other people's stupidity.
- free_rms 6y ago
  Guess I fell afoul of Poe's law on that one.

deleted 6y ago

[deleted]