7 ms·

I just got one. I’m blown away by the speed as well. Chrome runs insanely fast! Alas, it’s not developer ready yet. Brew is a mess. Docker doesn’t work. PyCharm

I just got one. I’m blown away by the speed as well. Chrome runs insanely fast! Alas, it’s not developer ready yet. Brew is a mess. Docker doesn’t work. PyCharm is WIP although can use x86 version. I was skeptical of the hype but this little laptop has made me realize how slow everything else is. Unfortunately, while the hardware has accelerated far beyond expectations, the software - specifically MacOS BigSur is a major step backward. So many fucking animations. Everything feels fluid like operating in molasses. The UI changes seem to be shoe horned into a desktop that doesn’t need giant white space for fat fingers. Menu bars are twice as tall taking up precious space. Top bar was already crammed with a lot of icons. Now, they’ve made them sparsely spaced by adding padding between the icons. Everything is baby-like with rounded corners and without borders. Segmentation UI elements are no more. I want to ask Apple’s UI team: WHY!? What is currently wrong with macOS Catalina UI? Until you can satisfactorily answer that, there shouldn’t be any change. Stop changing the UI like you’re working at Hermès. It’s not fashion. If the reason is to unify everything, all screen sizes, then you’re sacrificing all three. Perhaps making it easy to develop apps for all 3 platforms is a plus, but as a user, this all feels like a regression. I’ve lost hope in modern UI engineering. It’s not engineering anymore. I want macOS that has a UI of Windows 95. That would be totally insane on Apple Silicon.

fassssst 6y ago
Seems pretty obvious that some future Macs will have touch screens or larger iPads will run MacOS. I’d buy a Surface Studio style iMac in a heartbeat.
- robaye 6y ago
  This was my thought too.
- fsflover 6y ago
  Sounds like you are speaking about https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Technological_convergence https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Technological_convergence.
- ryukafalz 6y ago
  I was really hoping they'd announce a $500 touchscreen lapdock for iPhones with a mounting arm that used MagSafe. Turn iPhones into Macs. It'd be the slickest lapdock I can think of. Not expecting them to, but maybe one day.
- alwillis 6y ago
  Seems pretty obvious that some future Macs will have touch screens or larger iPads will run MacOS. Probably not. Apple has said they've prototyped touch screen Macs and from a UI/UX perspective, it doesn't really work. They've recently downplayed touchscreen Mac talk recently [1]. What Apple has shown is iPadOS becoming more like macOS, supporting a keyboard and a mouse instead of the other way around. I have a 2-in-1 Surface on loan and it's not particularly good at being a laptop or a tablet because of the design tradeoffs that have to be made. Apple is unlikely to make such a device unless there's some kind of UI/UX breakthrough. [1]: https://9to5mac.com/2020/11/12/apple-touchscreen-mac-interview/ https://9to5mac.com/2020/11/12/apple-touchscreen-mac-intervi...
  - toast0 6y ago
    Apple also said they weren't going to make a phone while they were working on a phone. A denial by Apple doesn't mean much (in either direction).
    - alwillis 6y ago
      That was the gamesmanship of Steve Jobs nearly 15 years ago. He didn't say we prototyped phones and there's nothing we can add to them. Again, not to rule anything out but I wouldn't hold my breath.
- partiallypro 6y ago
  I honestly feel like they won't do this for one simple reason: Why sell one devices when you can force consumers to buy two? Apple is keen on somehow making customers buy more things, more accessories, etc. They aren't the biggest company in the world for nothing. They say it's some fridge and microwave whatever excuse, but the real reason is money. The M1 chip itself lowers their costs by almost $3B.
goatinaboat 6y ago
It’s not fashion. Unfortunately you are wrong. Everything we call tech is in fact driven by fashion. My older version Mac is badgering me to upgrade to Bug Sur. Top feature: 100 new emojis. That is what Apple prioritised. Why the hell are emojis even part of the OS let alone its top feature! Truth is GUIs are done, were a decade or more ago. All there is left now is change for the sake of change. And Apple can’t think of anything more to do in the real OS either!
- saagarjha 6y ago
  https://www.apple.com/macos/big-sur/ https://www.apple.com/macos/big-sur/ says it's the new design.
- titzer 6y ago
  I think you're getting downvoted just because you said "you are wrong", when the rest of your comment, though a little grumpy, isn't that far from the truth. UIs are definitely fashion. We're going round and round in circles and things aren't getting better, IMHO.
- jolux 6y ago
  Emoji are part of the OS because they’re frequently displayed on websites and in applications, so the system font needs to support them to render them correctly.
  - recursive 6y ago
    So does MacOS require an operating system update to get a new font?
    - jolux 6y ago
      Fonts are software.
    - SulfurHexaFluri 6y ago
      No you can load your own fonts if you want but the default ones are distributed in OS updates like every other OS. Because Apple controls the end devices an OS update is very simple and goes out to basically all users so they don't have to rely on weird slide loading hacks that are typical for platforms like Android.
DennisP 6y ago
Ugh. Back in the 90s our supercomputers were way less powerful than today's laptops. I want to feel that. Never mind animations, just make everything happen instantly.
- keanebean86 6y ago
  I agree 100% animations are out of control. There are a few situations where the animations hide loading. Instead of the ui freezing temporarily there's a fancy animation. Outside of situations like that I just want an instant action.
  - taliesinb 6y ago
    Yeah. There is this system wide bug on iOS where the animations actually BLOCK user input / state changes. You can see this if you type in your pass code fast enough on the lock screen, such that you are interrupting the animated fade in of the dot for the previous digit. You’ll often lose a digit and have to start again from scratch. Infuriating! It’s the most fundamental relationship to betray, the relationship between touch and input. It registered my touch, but decided to ignore it because it wasn’t done with its pointless animation that some manager thought would look neat. Same thing happened with calculator and they fixed that one case, whereas it’s clearly a fundamental issue with UIKit.
    - ubercow13 6y ago
      Ugh yes, this is infuriating and happens all over the place. And combine it with sinusoidally tweened animations where it often looks like the tail end of the animation has finished before it really has, making it easy to mistime your inputs so they they’re dropped.
dheera 6y ago
On the other hand, Apple is fashion. They have always advertised and placed themselves as such. If you want functionality, you need a non-Mac running Linux. I'm just hoping we have better silicon options soon, for those of us who don't want customization-unfriendly, upgrade-unfriendly Apple hardware.
- chipotle_coyote 6y ago
  While you're getting rightfully downvoted (although I won't join in), it's worth underlining how much "they have always advertised and placed themselves as such" is utter nonsense. Apple has always advertised functionality and performance of their products, even when the case was (charitably) pretty shaky. They advertised their PowerPC Macs that way, up until the point they couldn't, then advertised their Intel Macs that way. Now they're advertising their ARM Macs that way. They proudly advertised their moves to 64-bit CPUs. They proudly advertised to consumers how cool it was that OS X was "Unix certified." Repeat: to consumers. Yes, Apple is super conscious of design, occasionally to an obvious fault, from "butterfly" keyboards back through the G4 Cube. But they've absolutely always been interested in aiming for seriously high-end machines, from all of the Mac Pro incarnations all the way back to oldies like the Mac IIfx. I hope other people make competitive silicon, too. I want Linux around and high-performing, and it's still a bit of an open question what the future holds for development environments on ARM-based Macs. But it is just so wearying for people who are otherwise technically literate to still be trotting out "Apple has never cared about anything but looks" after literally decades of obvious counter-examples.
  - FireBeyond 6y ago
    > Apple has always advertised functionality and performance of their products, even when the case was (charitably) pretty shaky. "I'm a Mac." "And I'm a PC." was _absolutely_ designed to appeal to the fashionable, "hey, you're going to be far cooler than this stuffy nerd" than just "functionality and performance". So, in among everything else, they absolutely do care about looks. I'll agree that they don't "[not care] about anything but looks", but it's a part of the brand.
  - encom 6y ago
bound008 6y ago
I've had "reduce motion" turned off on my iOS devices since it was an options... The animations in the latest Messages.app have been driving me crazy, but sure enough "Reduce Motion" is available in the `Accessibility` preference panel under display. FWIW, I am blown away by my M1 Mac, but my x86 Mac feels about 5-10% snappier on Big Sur.
- cmdshiftf4 6y ago
  >I am blown away by my M1 Mac, but my x86 Mac feels about 5-10% snappier on Big Sur. For clarification, do you mean your x86 with Big Sur is faster 5-10% faster than you M1 with Big Sur, or is it compared with the same machine running what I'm going to guess is Catalina?
  - bound008 6y ago
    Sorry, I mean my x86 machine has improved in performance with the upgrade to Big Sur. The M1 MBA (16gb RAM) feels snappier and more responsive in almost every way to my Mac Mini w/64gb of RAM. RAM usage is also noticeably lower on the M1 when I migrated my browser tabs over (500+ between Firefox and Safari).
    - cmdshiftf4 6y ago
      Very interesting. Thanks for the clarification.
- Eric_WVGG 6y ago
  second this. The roll-out was a mess, but Big Sur does appear to have some serious optimizations under the hood. Time Machine is also, finally, vastly improved. (The changes to menu bar icon behavior, and shortcut keys on modal buttons, are infuriating)
creddit 6y ago
Brew is only slightly a mess, in my experience. I've installed brew both in the historical /usr/local location as well as the future home of /opt/homebrew. I then created these two aliases: alias armbrew="/opt/homebrew/bin/brew" alias intbrew="arch -x86_64 /usr/local/bin/brew" My PATH selects for programs installed in the /opt/homebrew location first and then /usr/local. I try to install with the ARM version first with `armbrew install -s <PKG>` and if it fails, I move to using the `intbrew` alias as normal. I haven't really had any issues. It's obviously still messy but not in a way that is too bad!
- rewtraw 6y ago
  Running iTerm/Terminal in Rosetta allows it to work without issue, it's the best solution until more packages work natively under ARM. Duplicate iTerm.app, right click & "Get Info", check "Open in Rosetta". Now install homebrew how you would on an Intel Mac and everything will work.
  - creddit 6y ago
    This certainly works but then everything I install runs in Rosetta2. I'd prefer to run as much native as possible which is what my "two brew" solution gives me.
- thoughtsimple 6y ago
  I've been using MacPorts instead of Homebrew. It seems further ahead on the Darwin AArch64 transition. About 80% of things that I've tried have worked without trouble. Unfortunately, ffmpeg wasn't one of them. I got that working yesterday with libx264 and libx265 integration. Oddly, libx265 installs fine under MacPorts but libx264 doesn't. But I was able to download the latest from git and build it and copy it manually to /opt/local.
krrrh 6y ago
It’s pretty trivial to disable most animations (and more importantly transparency!). I’ve been doing that on new MacOS installs since Jaguar and it only takes a few minutes. If you want to move quickly you’re probably already using keyboard shortcuts and ignoring the dock and toolbars. For less technically adept users (ie. most users) the animations and spacings mostly seem to help them understand what’s going on. I know everyone has their preferences, but I don’t really get the level of griping that accompanies every release.
- lynndotpy 6y ago
  The animations on the iPhone are what made me return to Android. On iPhones, you can only "reduce motion", which still has the "moving through molasses" feeling, replacing them with a fade in/out. Can you truly disable most animations in MacOS, or are they simply replaced with fade in/out animations?
  - peteretep 6y ago
    Counter point: I only just noticed my iPhone animates things after I read this comment and went to find some.
    - codercotton 6y ago
      Animations used to be ~2x slower, /that/ was painful. It's much better now, though I could go with another 2x speedup personally.
      - bschwindHN 6y ago
        Wasn't it the case that they used to prevent touch interactions until the animation finished? I remember moving to iOS from android in 2017 and being really annoyed at that, but they fixed it in like iOS 11 or 12.
      - dariusj18 6y ago
        They used animations as loading times, not bad UX to prevent you from staring at a blank screen, or waiting for an app to open, thinking the phone didn't register your action.
vimy 6y ago
You can start terminal in rosetta mode and most brew packages will work. Cmd + i on terminal.app, rosetta mode.
FroshKiller 6y ago
With so many projects in need of changes to work on the M1, it sounds like it's more than ready for developers.
- irateswami 6y ago
  Ready for developers to port developer tools =/= ready for all developers. Systems dev is actually a fairly niche role in the industry, M1 will be a boon to them but for the vast majority of devs who either aren't interested in that kind of work or not trained in it, M1 is a huge monkey wrench. I buy a new MPB every two years, and you bet your ass my next one will be an M1. But that'll be in 2022, I'll be quite happy to stay on my x86 machine until then :)
- SulfurHexaFluri 6y ago
  Ready for macos app devs. Not ready for web devs / dev ops / etc
apatheticonion 6y ago
> I want macOS that has a UI of Windows 95. That would be totally insane on Apple Silicon. So much this. I used to run Windows 7 in classic mode and really liked the low footprint, no nonsense appearance. Windows 10 has no such mode. I wonder if we will see Linux support
- spurgu 6y ago
  Linus on the topic: https://i.redd.it/0c7c4h2t9u061.png https://i.redd.it/0c7c4h2t9u061.png
  - bawolff 6y ago
    That's not really on this topic. What linus wants to use personally has little bearing on what architectures linux will (eventually) support. Edit To clarify: i mean, linus is saying he wouldnt go to the trouble personally, not that he would reject a patch adding support. Those are two very different things.
    - spurgu 6y ago
      How is "Apple may run Linux in their cloud, but their laptops don't ;(" not on topic? Edit: It's not like Apple has any (commercial) interest in working with the Linux kernel developers to ensure support/compatibility even if the M1 is ARM based. Edit 2: Don't get me wrong, if Apple announces they will support Linux I'll run out the door and buy one now, as a MacOS user. Edit 3: And this is a criticism against Apple running Intel x86 chips. Do you really think the M1 future is looking rosy for Linux?
      - bluedino 6y ago
        That didn’t have anything to do with the UI which was the topicp
        spurgu 6y ago
        Scroll up, I responded directly to this: > I wonder if we will see Linux support
treis 6y ago
>I just got one. I’m blown away by the speed as well. Chrome runs insanely fast! I've got a 5ish year old desktop and Chrome runs, afaict, pretty much instantaneously. At least I don't notice a perceptible delay. I'd be interested to see a side by side comparison of page renders on M1 vs an older laptop.
murukesh_s 6y ago
>Chrome runs insanely fast! Alas, What hardware you were using before? I am using MBP retina 2013 and chrome loads and run fast. Browsing was never a bottleneck except few heavily bloated (ads and stuff) pages. I have noticed chrome can slow down on few windows machine with poorer hardware(which is the case of 90% of windows laptops).
jerf 6y ago
"it’s not developer ready yet." Hey, what if we just... kept it that way? Kiss all that speed goodbye once software developers get their hands on this. And then the low end current-gen models will be even slower when running "the code that runs ok on the M1 hardware, I guess, ship it."
- smnrchrds 6y ago
  For cross-platform software like Chrome and Electron apps, this will never happen, as the main target and market will still be Windows and x86-64.
- ultrarunner 6y ago
  It’s unclear to me how reduced availability of developer tooling will result in a faster software experience for M1 owners.
  - Shish2k 6y ago
    If developers are forced to use slow machines to develop, then they’re less likely to build bloaty slow software that depends on fast machines
    - ultrarunner 6y ago
      Maybe, but also If developers are forced to use slow machines to develop, then they’re less likely to build. Full stop. I'm actually in this situation right now. I develop a web application for event management. In some cases it's being used on older Chromebooks, where speed is, well, not there. While I'm testing on Chromebooks, I'm definitely not building my front end bundle on one. The faster machine I'm on, the faster I can iterate on building fast data tables, making intelligent choices about asset loading, etc. So yeah, I think something like the Network Conditioner prefpane should exist to simulate a slow CPU for testing (does something like this exist?). But I very much enjoy my fast dev machine and I think it'll have the best overall outcome.
- donmcronald 6y ago
pcr910303 6y ago
While I won’t go that far, arguing that macOS with a Windows 95 UI is a good idea, I do agree that Big Sur’s current UI is a mess. Traditional macOS users valued the Mac user interface deeply, and IMO that was why while iOS 7 got a big refresh, macOS got a much smaller one, only with flatness refinements. Big Sur feels like the iOS 7 for the Mac, and I’m very sad that I’ll have to wait at least 4~5 years to see the new interface improve in a better state. Some of my key annoyances (except for bugs): * The new control center now requires more clicks, but due to the padding getting bigger, I can’t put all of the shortcut icons in the menu bar * The new control center and notification center’s UI is so foreign from other parts of the macOS. It’s just… so custom. * There are now multiple variants of the title bar thickness, and all of the Apple apps now use all four. It just feels ugly. The title ban of the Photos app and the Calendar app are almost the same — why does one use a .unified one and one uses a .unifiedCompact one? And why does Safari uses a .unified one when it doesn’t really have any information to convey? * This is from Catalina, but the NSSwitch stuff collides with checkboxes… but well I’m guessing that’s for Catalyst trying to look native I can go on and on… but my general feeling of Big Sur’s UI is that it would take multiple years to make this better.
- pilsetnieks 6y ago
  I don't even care about the UI flourishes and whatnot, I just want them to observe their own HIG and preventing 3rd parties from abuses, and that would be a huge win. It used to be that focus stealing on OS X was a cardinal sin and now no one cares. If they only fix a single thing in the entire OS, it should be this.
- saagarjha 6y ago
  > The new control center and notification center’s UI is so foreign from other parts of the macOS. It’s just… so custom. Apparently it’s all SwiftUI, which makes it look strange and animate weirdly.
- IggleSniggle 6y ago
  This is actually how I feel about modern iOS too. Why is it a swipe there, a modal there...none of it has a rhyme or reason that makes sense to me. Ok, to get what I want here, do I need to force push, swipe, or tap some icon somewhere? There’s no consistency, everything is hidden, and each little thing to use the OS better is a “trick.” On my personal iPhone, you swipe from the bottom to get Control Center, and on my work iPhone, you swipe from the top corner. If you want to send the output of one program to the input of another, you click share, move past a bunch of Contacts and Airdrop etc that I don’t think I’ve ever used in this way, swipe left/right to find an app, don’t find it, and either need to click an “Add” or “Other” button OR you need to swipe further down to click More..., until you can select thing you actually want. I have so many gripes with the whole system. I almost believe that they are trying to make the thing harder to use so that they can create a dark-pattern around feeling a sense of mastery...but when I was trying to walk an elderly relative through the menus over the phone, it became especially obvious just much specialized knowledge the iPhone requires in order to do the very most basic of things, and almost NONE of it is discoverable.
spurgu 6y ago
Not too many people seem to be commenting on the UI but the Big Sur "improvements" were one of the main things that made me look into going back to Linux, researching how to replace my current MacOS workflow. The UI changes are just completely nonsensical to me, and despite the initial announcements of the speed benefits of the M1 I was set on trying to go back to Linux. But now with articles like these I have to admit it feels tempting...
JumpCrisscross 6y ago
> Stop changing the UI like you’re working at Hermès. It’s not fashion. Of course it is. Our phones are intimately close to us. Physically, cognitively, socially and even emotionally. They may be the most widely-owned intimately-connected object humans have ever invented outside religion. Our computers don't occupy as close of a niche. But they're in a similar space. I agree with your observation that the new OS feels like molasses. I wish they went for a "snappy" feel. (Though keyboard shortcuts get around that.) But ignoring that Macs and iPhones are objects of fashion as well as computing devices misses a deep part of what Jobs saw that technologists missed.
- herodoturtle 6y ago
  Well said. I think the beauty of the iPhone lies in its elegance, but I suspect I'll always code on my Linux computer.
- RachelF 6y ago
  But one can choose to ignore fashion and wear comfortable clothes. Apple has chosen to make everyone live in its crazy world. Letting users skin the OS would be a better choice.
  - zakki 6y ago
    Usual answer is: go buy other vendor product.
    - kyriakos 6y ago
      Judging from HN posts that's what a lot of people are doing
      - Razengan 6y ago
        Judging from news about sales and profits that’s what a lot more people are not doing.
  - alwillis 6y ago
nikolay 6y ago
Yeah, a lot of spacing... except of dismissing notifications! The small X icons are so hard to click on Big Sur!!! I miss the old notifications! The grouping makes my work even harder! It's a notifications disaster!
threw234342543 6y ago
Oh man, how I wish we could run linux on this puppy.
phillco 6y ago
> I want macOS that has a UI of Windows 95. That would be totally insane on Apple Silicon. You don't even need to go as far as Windows. Classic Mac OS would be just fine.
- vt240 6y ago
  Yes, can I please have System 7.1 or 7.5.3 back? I recently installed MAE on my SunBlade 2500 and it has been an amazing experience. A Classic Mac, without all the issues of HFS corruption from crashing out. Running 68k software at G4 speeds. Haha. For a lot of tasks it certainly works better than the Classic environment did under 10.1-4 since it's not targeting the System 9.2.
  - lukeh 6y ago
    Well, that was the beginning of Classic.
matthewmacleod 6y ago
The thing is, I just don’t see the problem. I upgraded from Mojave last week, noted that the UI is slightly different, and… that’s it. Everything still works fine, the UI looks a little more similar to the iPad, and I figured that was probably the main reason - since people will be running iOS apps on Macs going forward, there’s been an effort to introduce some more consistency. I find it incredibly hard to get worked up about it.
- SulfurHexaFluri 6y ago
  Have been on big sur for a week now and I don't see the issue either. Things like the control center are a huge addition and mostly the ipad like changes were to border radii and colors unlike the windows 8 disaster.
webmaven 6y ago
> I want macOS that has a UI of Windows 95. That would be totally insane on Apple Silicon. You'd have to redesign it somewhat for the higher resolution screen, and so there are many improvements in typographical rendering you would also want to include, plus Win95 was in some respects still inferior to System 7, but overall, yes, there is a certain directness to that era of OS UIs (see also Motif & BeOS).
socialdemocrat 6y ago
I don't mind an upgrade to better looking UIs on regular intervals, but functionality and ease of use should come first. And here there is pandering to the iOS crowd when a touch based interface makes no sense for an OS operated with a mouse and a keyboard. But I suspect it is a consequence of the incessant screaming by all the hipsters and clueless morons that think iOS and macOS should be merged for no other reason than their belief in MORE is MORE. No LESS is MORE, and that is what Apple was built on. So yeah I feel your pain even if I have a slightly different take on this. macOS should be primarily designed to be the ultimate OS for somebody using a mouse and keyboard. iOS should be optimized for touch. We don't need to merge these two world. That is what clueless MBA types of people think. Because all they can think of is things like "synergy effects"...
- donmcronald 6y ago
  Imagine 2-in-1 where iOS and OSX lived alongside each other and you could switch between them like tablet mode on a surface pro. Just let them be independent of each other imo. I’d be up for that since I currently use an iPad and a win10 laptop.
cercatrova 6y ago
The increased padding, spread out buttons, big icons. Do you see the pattern? They're gonna make a touch screen Mac, whether it be in the form of a laptop, iMac, or an iPad running macOS.
swiley 6y ago
Run an open source OS if you don't want stuff ripped out from underneath you. Preferably one like gentoo or alpine.
- Spivak 6y ago
  All my PCs run open source OSs and this really isn’t true. The GNU/Linux landscape has changed wildly in the last 5 or so years. You’re only slightly less beholden to the people that maintain your OS than with proprietary systems because you still have to update eventually. A lot of BSDs are still roughly the same but being OSS doesn’t necessarily imply you’re free of change.
  - mixcocam 6y ago
    - you can update whenever you want (or not do it ever) - you can modify any part of the OS, no restrictions - you can run any program you like: signed, unsigned, app-store, not app-store, etc. ==> the differences are there between OSX and GNU/LINUX
musicale 6y ago
> Docker doesn’t work "Docker" on macOS runs in a Linux VM under Xhyve iirc. I imagine they will make an ARM version but your x86 images are probably toast unless you can emulate them somehow.
- donmcronald 6y ago
  Apple should buy Docker. Only a partial /s on that one. I’m shocked Microsoft hasn’t bought Docker yet. Docker has so much mindshare it’s crazy. They’re the most valuable company that isn’t worth anything in the whole tech sector imo.
elcritch 6y ago
I actually really want to run native Linux on these new chips. Don't know why but the thought of modern "big sur" macOS on such beautiful hardware seems a bit sad to me. KDE/Manjaro has made me pretty happy lately and the battery life could make an amazing linux laptop. Of course you could run CDE or XFCE to get your Win95 DE. ;) Well in a few years when hopefully Linux supports M1 devices. Till then probably have to play with a PineBook or something.
herpderperator 6y ago
Edit: It looks like satire. My bad :) Doesn't your article here go directly against what you're saying? https://neil.computer/notes/hacker-news-design-is-ugly/ https://neil.computer/notes/hacker-news-design-is-ugly/ Specifically, you redesigned HN to have more "pop" and have rounded corners and padding: https://neil.computer/content/images/size/w1600/2020/07/Screen-Shot-2020-07-06-at-12.05.17-AM.png https://neil.computer/content/images/size/w1600/2020/07/Scre... which is exactly what you were saying macOS looks like... Isn't that hypocritical?
- klodolph 6y ago
  What the hell is going on here? Digging through someone's post history to figure out if there are contradictions in what someone says? Can we not just evaluate what people say on its own merit and instead of putting people under the lens for hypocrisy?
  - herpderperator 6y ago
    What is the point of putting links on your profile if you expect people won't visit them? It was on the index page. Anyway, it looks like satire. I definitely got fooled. My bad.
    - klodolph 6y ago
      Even if it weren't satire, investigating someone for inconsistencies like that... well, it just kinda sucks, doesn't it? I don't think we should expect people to have a consistent viewpoint across everything they've ever posted online.
- neilpanchal 6y ago
  lol that was satire, I didn't write it well enough :-) I absolutely adore HN's design. 100% serious!
dangus 6y ago
Let's make a new computing law: The likelihood of an opinion on UI changes to be an overreaction is inversely proportional to the length of time that has passed since their release.
ogre_codes 6y ago
> I want macOS that has a UI of Windows 95. That would be totally insane on Apple Silicon. WTF? I mean I get most of what you said until that. I vastly prefer the Catalina and every version of MacOS over the past 15 years versus anything out of Redmond, and particularly not W95. (Heck I used Window Maker prior to MacOS, my love for Next ancestors goes back some time) I hear a lot of people are frustrated with Big Sur. Hopefully Apple will dial back a lot of the egregious UI updates. They frequently go big on new redesigns, then dial things back. Hopefully.

fassssst 6y ago

Seems pretty obvious that some future Macs will have touch screens or larger iPads will run MacOS. I’d buy a Surface Studio style iMac in a heartbeat.

robaye 6y ago
This was my thought too.
fsflover 6y ago
Sounds like you are speaking about https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Technological_convergence https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Technological_convergence.
ryukafalz 6y ago
I was really hoping they'd announce a $500 touchscreen lapdock for iPhones with a mounting arm that used MagSafe. Turn iPhones into Macs. It'd be the slickest lapdock I can think of. Not expecting them to, but maybe one day.
alwillis 6y ago
Seems pretty obvious that some future Macs will have touch screens or larger iPads will run MacOS. Probably not. Apple has said they've prototyped touch screen Macs and from a UI/UX perspective, it doesn't really work. They've recently downplayed touchscreen Mac talk recently [1]. What Apple has shown is iPadOS becoming more like macOS, supporting a keyboard and a mouse instead of the other way around. I have a 2-in-1 Surface on loan and it's not particularly good at being a laptop or a tablet because of the design tradeoffs that have to be made. Apple is unlikely to make such a device unless there's some kind of UI/UX breakthrough. [1]: https://9to5mac.com/2020/11/12/apple-touchscreen-mac-interview/ https://9to5mac.com/2020/11/12/apple-touchscreen-mac-intervi...
- toast0 6y ago
  Apple also said they weren't going to make a phone while they were working on a phone. A denial by Apple doesn't mean much (in either direction).
  - alwillis 6y ago
    That was the gamesmanship of Steve Jobs nearly 15 years ago. He didn't say we prototyped phones and there's nothing we can add to them. Again, not to rule anything out but I wouldn't hold my breath.
partiallypro 6y ago
I honestly feel like they won't do this for one simple reason: Why sell one devices when you can force consumers to buy two? Apple is keen on somehow making customers buy more things, more accessories, etc. They aren't the biggest company in the world for nothing. They say it's some fridge and microwave whatever excuse, but the real reason is money. The M1 chip itself lowers their costs by almost $3B.

goatinaboat 6y ago

It’s not fashion. Unfortunately you are wrong. Everything we call tech is in fact driven by fashion. My older version Mac is badgering me to upgrade to Bug Sur. Top feature: 100 new emojis. That is what Apple prioritised. Why the hell are emojis even part of the OS let alone its top feature! Truth is GUIs are done, were a decade or more ago. All there is left now is change for the sake of change. And Apple can’t think of anything more to do in the real OS either!

saagarjha 6y ago
https://www.apple.com/macos/big-sur/ https://www.apple.com/macos/big-sur/ says it's the new design.
titzer 6y ago
I think you're getting downvoted just because you said "you are wrong", when the rest of your comment, though a little grumpy, isn't that far from the truth. UIs are definitely fashion. We're going round and round in circles and things aren't getting better, IMHO.
jolux 6y ago
Emoji are part of the OS because they’re frequently displayed on websites and in applications, so the system font needs to support them to render them correctly.
- recursive 6y ago
  So does MacOS require an operating system update to get a new font?
  - jolux 6y ago
    Fonts are software.
  - SulfurHexaFluri 6y ago
    No you can load your own fonts if you want but the default ones are distributed in OS updates like every other OS. Because Apple controls the end devices an OS update is very simple and goes out to basically all users so they don't have to rely on weird slide loading hacks that are typical for platforms like Android.

DennisP 6y ago

Ugh. Back in the 90s our supercomputers were way less powerful than today's laptops. I want to feel that. Never mind animations, just make everything happen instantly.

keanebean86 6y ago
I agree 100% animations are out of control. There are a few situations where the animations hide loading. Instead of the ui freezing temporarily there's a fancy animation. Outside of situations like that I just want an instant action.
- taliesinb 6y ago
  Yeah. There is this system wide bug on iOS where the animations actually BLOCK user input / state changes. You can see this if you type in your pass code fast enough on the lock screen, such that you are interrupting the animated fade in of the dot for the previous digit. You’ll often lose a digit and have to start again from scratch. Infuriating! It’s the most fundamental relationship to betray, the relationship between touch and input. It registered my touch, but decided to ignore it because it wasn’t done with its pointless animation that some manager thought would look neat. Same thing happened with calculator and they fixed that one case, whereas it’s clearly a fundamental issue with UIKit.
  - ubercow13 6y ago
    Ugh yes, this is infuriating and happens all over the place. And combine it with sinusoidally tweened animations where it often looks like the tail end of the animation has finished before it really has, making it easy to mistime your inputs so they they’re dropped.

dheera 6y ago

On the other hand, Apple is fashion. They have always advertised and placed themselves as such. If you want functionality, you need a non-Mac running Linux. I'm just hoping we have better silicon options soon, for those of us who don't want customization-unfriendly, upgrade-unfriendly Apple hardware.

chipotle_coyote 6y ago
While you're getting rightfully downvoted (although I won't join in), it's worth underlining how much "they have always advertised and placed themselves as such" is utter nonsense. Apple has always advertised functionality and performance of their products, even when the case was (charitably) pretty shaky. They advertised their PowerPC Macs that way, up until the point they couldn't, then advertised their Intel Macs that way. Now they're advertising their ARM Macs that way. They proudly advertised their moves to 64-bit CPUs. They proudly advertised to consumers how cool it was that OS X was "Unix certified." Repeat: to consumers. Yes, Apple is super conscious of design, occasionally to an obvious fault, from "butterfly" keyboards back through the G4 Cube. But they've absolutely always been interested in aiming for seriously high-end machines, from all of the Mac Pro incarnations all the way back to oldies like the Mac IIfx. I hope other people make competitive silicon, too. I want Linux around and high-performing, and it's still a bit of an open question what the future holds for development environments on ARM-based Macs. But it is just so wearying for people who are otherwise technically literate to still be trotting out "Apple has never cared about anything but looks" after literally decades of obvious counter-examples.
- FireBeyond 6y ago
  > Apple has always advertised functionality and performance of their products, even when the case was (charitably) pretty shaky. "I'm a Mac." "And I'm a PC." was _absolutely_ designed to appeal to the fashionable, "hey, you're going to be far cooler than this stuffy nerd" than just "functionality and performance". So, in among everything else, they absolutely do care about looks. I'll agree that they don't "[not care] about anything but looks", but it's a part of the brand.
- encom 6y ago

bound008 6y ago

I've had "reduce motion" turned off on my iOS devices since it was an options... The animations in the latest Messages.app have been driving me crazy, but sure enough "Reduce Motion" is available in the `Accessibility` preference panel under display. FWIW, I am blown away by my M1 Mac, but my x86 Mac feels about 5-10% snappier on Big Sur.

cmdshiftf4 6y ago
>I am blown away by my M1 Mac, but my x86 Mac feels about 5-10% snappier on Big Sur. For clarification, do you mean your x86 with Big Sur is faster 5-10% faster than you M1 with Big Sur, or is it compared with the same machine running what I'm going to guess is Catalina?
- bound008 6y ago
  Sorry, I mean my x86 machine has improved in performance with the upgrade to Big Sur. The M1 MBA (16gb RAM) feels snappier and more responsive in almost every way to my Mac Mini w/64gb of RAM. RAM usage is also noticeably lower on the M1 when I migrated my browser tabs over (500+ between Firefox and Safari).
  - cmdshiftf4 6y ago
    Very interesting. Thanks for the clarification.
Eric_WVGG 6y ago
second this. The roll-out was a mess, but Big Sur does appear to have some serious optimizations under the hood. Time Machine is also, finally, vastly improved. (The changes to menu bar icon behavior, and shortcut keys on modal buttons, are infuriating)

creddit 6y ago

Brew is only slightly a mess, in my experience. I've installed brew both in the historical /usr/local location as well as the future home of /opt/homebrew. I then created these two aliases: alias armbrew="/opt/homebrew/bin/brew" alias intbrew="arch -x86_64 /usr/local/bin/brew" My PATH selects for programs installed in the /opt/homebrew location first and then /usr/local. I try to install with the ARM version first with `armbrew install -s <PKG>` and if it fails, I move to using the `intbrew` alias as normal. I haven't really had any issues. It's obviously still messy but not in a way that is too bad!

rewtraw 6y ago
Running iTerm/Terminal in Rosetta allows it to work without issue, it's the best solution until more packages work natively under ARM. Duplicate iTerm.app, right click & "Get Info", check "Open in Rosetta". Now install homebrew how you would on an Intel Mac and everything will work.
- creddit 6y ago
  This certainly works but then everything I install runs in Rosetta2. I'd prefer to run as much native as possible which is what my "two brew" solution gives me.
thoughtsimple 6y ago
I've been using MacPorts instead of Homebrew. It seems further ahead on the Darwin AArch64 transition. About 80% of things that I've tried have worked without trouble. Unfortunately, ffmpeg wasn't one of them. I got that working yesterday with libx264 and libx265 integration. Oddly, libx265 installs fine under MacPorts but libx264 doesn't. But I was able to download the latest from git and build it and copy it manually to /opt/local.

krrrh 6y ago

It’s pretty trivial to disable most animations (and more importantly transparency!). I’ve been doing that on new MacOS installs since Jaguar and it only takes a few minutes. If you want to move quickly you’re probably already using keyboard shortcuts and ignoring the dock and toolbars. For less technically adept users (ie. most users) the animations and spacings mostly seem to help them understand what’s going on. I know everyone has their preferences, but I don’t really get the level of griping that accompanies every release.

lynndotpy 6y ago
The animations on the iPhone are what made me return to Android. On iPhones, you can only "reduce motion", which still has the "moving through molasses" feeling, replacing them with a fade in/out. Can you truly disable most animations in MacOS, or are they simply replaced with fade in/out animations?
- peteretep 6y ago
  Counter point: I only just noticed my iPhone animates things after I read this comment and went to find some.
  - codercotton 6y ago
    Animations used to be ~2x slower, /that/ was painful. It's much better now, though I could go with another 2x speedup personally.
    - bschwindHN 6y ago
      Wasn't it the case that they used to prevent touch interactions until the animation finished? I remember moving to iOS from android in 2017 and being really annoyed at that, but they fixed it in like iOS 11 or 12.
    - dariusj18 6y ago
      They used animations as loading times, not bad UX to prevent you from staring at a blank screen, or waiting for an app to open, thinking the phone didn't register your action.

vimy 6y ago

You can start terminal in rosetta mode and most brew packages will work. Cmd + i on terminal.app, rosetta mode.

FroshKiller 6y ago

With so many projects in need of changes to work on the M1, it sounds like it's more than ready for developers.

irateswami 6y ago
Ready for developers to port developer tools =/= ready for all developers. Systems dev is actually a fairly niche role in the industry, M1 will be a boon to them but for the vast majority of devs who either aren't interested in that kind of work or not trained in it, M1 is a huge monkey wrench. I buy a new MPB every two years, and you bet your ass my next one will be an M1. But that'll be in 2022, I'll be quite happy to stay on my x86 machine until then :)
SulfurHexaFluri 6y ago
Ready for macos app devs. Not ready for web devs / dev ops / etc

apatheticonion 6y ago

> I want macOS that has a UI of Windows 95. That would be totally insane on Apple Silicon. So much this. I used to run Windows 7 in classic mode and really liked the low footprint, no nonsense appearance. Windows 10 has no such mode. I wonder if we will see Linux support

spurgu 6y ago
Linus on the topic: https://i.redd.it/0c7c4h2t9u061.png https://i.redd.it/0c7c4h2t9u061.png
- bawolff 6y ago
  That's not really on this topic. What linus wants to use personally has little bearing on what architectures linux will (eventually) support. Edit To clarify: i mean, linus is saying he wouldnt go to the trouble personally, not that he would reject a patch adding support. Those are two very different things.
  - spurgu 6y ago
    How is "Apple may run Linux in their cloud, but their laptops don't ;(" not on topic? Edit: It's not like Apple has any (commercial) interest in working with the Linux kernel developers to ensure support/compatibility even if the M1 is ARM based. Edit 2: Don't get me wrong, if Apple announces they will support Linux I'll run out the door and buy one now, as a MacOS user. Edit 3: And this is a criticism against Apple running Intel x86 chips. Do you really think the M1 future is looking rosy for Linux?
    - bluedino 6y ago
      That didn’t have anything to do with the UI which was the topicp
      - spurgu 6y ago
        Scroll up, I responded directly to this: > I wonder if we will see Linux support

treis 6y ago

>I just got one. I’m blown away by the speed as well. Chrome runs insanely fast! I've got a 5ish year old desktop and Chrome runs, afaict, pretty much instantaneously. At least I don't notice a perceptible delay. I'd be interested to see a side by side comparison of page renders on M1 vs an older laptop.

murukesh_s 6y ago

>Chrome runs insanely fast! Alas, What hardware you were using before? I am using MBP retina 2013 and chrome loads and run fast. Browsing was never a bottleneck except few heavily bloated (ads and stuff) pages. I have noticed chrome can slow down on few windows machine with poorer hardware(which is the case of 90% of windows laptops).

jerf 6y ago

"it’s not developer ready yet." Hey, what if we just... kept it that way? Kiss all that speed goodbye once software developers get their hands on this. And then the low end current-gen models will be even slower when running "the code that runs ok on the M1 hardware, I guess, ship it."

smnrchrds 6y ago
For cross-platform software like Chrome and Electron apps, this will never happen, as the main target and market will still be Windows and x86-64.
ultrarunner 6y ago
It’s unclear to me how reduced availability of developer tooling will result in a faster software experience for M1 owners.
- Shish2k 6y ago
  If developers are forced to use slow machines to develop, then they’re less likely to build bloaty slow software that depends on fast machines
  - ultrarunner 6y ago
    Maybe, but also If developers are forced to use slow machines to develop, then they’re less likely to build. Full stop. I'm actually in this situation right now. I develop a web application for event management. In some cases it's being used on older Chromebooks, where speed is, well, not there. While I'm testing on Chromebooks, I'm definitely not building my front end bundle on one. The faster machine I'm on, the faster I can iterate on building fast data tables, making intelligent choices about asset loading, etc. So yeah, I think something like the Network Conditioner prefpane should exist to simulate a slow CPU for testing (does something like this exist?). But I very much enjoy my fast dev machine and I think it'll have the best overall outcome.
donmcronald 6y ago

pcr910303 6y ago

While I won’t go that far, arguing that macOS with a Windows 95 UI is a good idea, I do agree that Big Sur’s current UI is a mess. Traditional macOS users valued the Mac user interface deeply, and IMO that was why while iOS 7 got a big refresh, macOS got a much smaller one, only with flatness refinements. Big Sur feels like the iOS 7 for the Mac, and I’m very sad that I’ll have to wait at least 4~5 years to see the new interface improve in a better state. Some of my key annoyances (except for bugs): * The new control center now requires more clicks, but due to the padding getting bigger, I can’t put all of the shortcut icons in the menu bar * The new control center and notification center’s UI is so foreign from other parts of the macOS. It’s just… so custom. * There are now multiple variants of the title bar thickness, and all of the Apple apps now use all four. It just feels ugly. The title ban of the Photos app and the Calendar app are almost the same — why does one use a .unified one and one uses a .unifiedCompact one? And why does Safari uses a .unified one when it doesn’t really have any information to convey? * This is from Catalina, but the NSSwitch stuff collides with checkboxes… but well I’m guessing that’s for Catalyst trying to look native I can go on and on… but my general feeling of Big Sur’s UI is that it would take multiple years to make this better.

pilsetnieks 6y ago
I don't even care about the UI flourishes and whatnot, I just want them to observe their own HIG and preventing 3rd parties from abuses, and that would be a huge win. It used to be that focus stealing on OS X was a cardinal sin and now no one cares. If they only fix a single thing in the entire OS, it should be this.
saagarjha 6y ago
> The new control center and notification center’s UI is so foreign from other parts of the macOS. It’s just… so custom. Apparently it’s all SwiftUI, which makes it look strange and animate weirdly.
IggleSniggle 6y ago
This is actually how I feel about modern iOS too. Why is it a swipe there, a modal there...none of it has a rhyme or reason that makes sense to me. Ok, to get what I want here, do I need to force push, swipe, or tap some icon somewhere? There’s no consistency, everything is hidden, and each little thing to use the OS better is a “trick.” On my personal iPhone, you swipe from the bottom to get Control Center, and on my work iPhone, you swipe from the top corner. If you want to send the output of one program to the input of another, you click share, move past a bunch of Contacts and Airdrop etc that I don’t think I’ve ever used in this way, swipe left/right to find an app, don’t find it, and either need to click an “Add” or “Other” button OR you need to swipe further down to click More..., until you can select thing you actually want. I have so many gripes with the whole system. I almost believe that they are trying to make the thing harder to use so that they can create a dark-pattern around feeling a sense of mastery...but when I was trying to walk an elderly relative through the menus over the phone, it became especially obvious just much specialized knowledge the iPhone requires in order to do the very most basic of things, and almost NONE of it is discoverable.

spurgu 6y ago

Not too many people seem to be commenting on the UI but the Big Sur "improvements" were one of the main things that made me look into going back to Linux, researching how to replace my current MacOS workflow. The UI changes are just completely nonsensical to me, and despite the initial announcements of the speed benefits of the M1 I was set on trying to go back to Linux. But now with articles like these I have to admit it feels tempting...

JumpCrisscross 6y ago

> Stop changing the UI like you’re working at Hermès. It’s not fashion. Of course it is. Our phones are intimately close to us. Physically, cognitively, socially and even emotionally. They may be the most widely-owned intimately-connected object humans have ever invented outside religion. Our computers don't occupy as close of a niche. But they're in a similar space. I agree with your observation that the new OS feels like molasses. I wish they went for a "snappy" feel. (Though keyboard shortcuts get around that.) But ignoring that Macs and iPhones are objects of fashion as well as computing devices misses a deep part of what Jobs saw that technologists missed.

herodoturtle 6y ago
Well said. I think the beauty of the iPhone lies in its elegance, but I suspect I'll always code on my Linux computer.
RachelF 6y ago
But one can choose to ignore fashion and wear comfortable clothes. Apple has chosen to make everyone live in its crazy world. Letting users skin the OS would be a better choice.
- zakki 6y ago
  Usual answer is: go buy other vendor product.
  - kyriakos 6y ago
    Judging from HN posts that's what a lot of people are doing
    - Razengan 6y ago
      Judging from news about sales and profits that’s what a lot more people are not doing.
- alwillis 6y ago

nikolay 6y ago

Yeah, a lot of spacing... except of dismissing notifications! The small X icons are so hard to click on Big Sur!!! I miss the old notifications! The grouping makes my work even harder! It's a notifications disaster!

threw234342543 6y ago

Oh man, how I wish we could run linux on this puppy.

phillco 6y ago

> I want macOS that has a UI of Windows 95. That would be totally insane on Apple Silicon. You don't even need to go as far as Windows. Classic Mac OS would be just fine.

vt240 6y ago
Yes, can I please have System 7.1 or 7.5.3 back? I recently installed MAE on my SunBlade 2500 and it has been an amazing experience. A Classic Mac, without all the issues of HFS corruption from crashing out. Running 68k software at G4 speeds. Haha. For a lot of tasks it certainly works better than the Classic environment did under 10.1-4 since it's not targeting the System 9.2.
- lukeh 6y ago
  Well, that was the beginning of Classic.

matthewmacleod 6y ago

The thing is, I just don’t see the problem. I upgraded from Mojave last week, noted that the UI is slightly different, and… that’s it. Everything still works fine, the UI looks a little more similar to the iPad, and I figured that was probably the main reason - since people will be running iOS apps on Macs going forward, there’s been an effort to introduce some more consistency. I find it incredibly hard to get worked up about it.

SulfurHexaFluri 6y ago
Have been on big sur for a week now and I don't see the issue either. Things like the control center are a huge addition and mostly the ipad like changes were to border radii and colors unlike the windows 8 disaster.

webmaven 6y ago

> I want macOS that has a UI of Windows 95. That would be totally insane on Apple Silicon. You'd have to redesign it somewhat for the higher resolution screen, and so there are many improvements in typographical rendering you would also want to include, plus Win95 was in some respects still inferior to System 7, but overall, yes, there is a certain directness to that era of OS UIs (see also Motif & BeOS).

socialdemocrat 6y ago

I don't mind an upgrade to better looking UIs on regular intervals, but functionality and ease of use should come first. And here there is pandering to the iOS crowd when a touch based interface makes no sense for an OS operated with a mouse and a keyboard. But I suspect it is a consequence of the incessant screaming by all the hipsters and clueless morons that think iOS and macOS should be merged for no other reason than their belief in MORE is MORE. No LESS is MORE, and that is what Apple was built on. So yeah I feel your pain even if I have a slightly different take on this. macOS should be primarily designed to be the ultimate OS for somebody using a mouse and keyboard. iOS should be optimized for touch. We don't need to merge these two world. That is what clueless MBA types of people think. Because all they can think of is things like "synergy effects"...

donmcronald 6y ago
Imagine 2-in-1 where iOS and OSX lived alongside each other and you could switch between them like tablet mode on a surface pro. Just let them be independent of each other imo. I’d be up for that since I currently use an iPad and a win10 laptop.

cercatrova 6y ago

The increased padding, spread out buttons, big icons. Do you see the pattern? They're gonna make a touch screen Mac, whether it be in the form of a laptop, iMac, or an iPad running macOS.

swiley 6y ago

Run an open source OS if you don't want stuff ripped out from underneath you. Preferably one like gentoo or alpine.

Spivak 6y ago
All my PCs run open source OSs and this really isn’t true. The GNU/Linux landscape has changed wildly in the last 5 or so years. You’re only slightly less beholden to the people that maintain your OS than with proprietary systems because you still have to update eventually. A lot of BSDs are still roughly the same but being OSS doesn’t necessarily imply you’re free of change.
- mixcocam 6y ago
  - you can update whenever you want (or not do it ever) - you can modify any part of the OS, no restrictions - you can run any program you like: signed, unsigned, app-store, not app-store, etc. ==> the differences are there between OSX and GNU/LINUX

musicale 6y ago

> Docker doesn’t work "Docker" on macOS runs in a Linux VM under Xhyve iirc. I imagine they will make an ARM version but your x86 images are probably toast unless you can emulate them somehow.

donmcronald 6y ago
Apple should buy Docker. Only a partial /s on that one. I’m shocked Microsoft hasn’t bought Docker yet. Docker has so much mindshare it’s crazy. They’re the most valuable company that isn’t worth anything in the whole tech sector imo.

elcritch 6y ago

I actually really want to run native Linux on these new chips. Don't know why but the thought of modern "big sur" macOS on such beautiful hardware seems a bit sad to me. KDE/Manjaro has made me pretty happy lately and the battery life could make an amazing linux laptop. Of course you could run CDE or XFCE to get your Win95 DE. ;) Well in a few years when hopefully Linux supports M1 devices. Till then probably have to play with a PineBook or something.

herpderperator 6y ago

Edit: It looks like satire. My bad :) Doesn't your article here go directly against what you're saying? https://neil.computer/notes/hacker-news-design-is-ugly/ https://neil.computer/notes/hacker-news-design-is-ugly/ Specifically, you redesigned HN to have more "pop" and have rounded corners and padding: https://neil.computer/content/images/size/w1600/2020/07/Screen-Shot-2020-07-06-at-12.05.17-AM.png https://neil.computer/content/images/size/w1600/2020/07/Scre... which is exactly what you were saying macOS looks like... Isn't that hypocritical?

klodolph 6y ago
What the hell is going on here? Digging through someone's post history to figure out if there are contradictions in what someone says? Can we not just evaluate what people say on its own merit and instead of putting people under the lens for hypocrisy?
- herpderperator 6y ago
  What is the point of putting links on your profile if you expect people won't visit them? It was on the index page. Anyway, it looks like satire. I definitely got fooled. My bad.
  - klodolph 6y ago
    Even if it weren't satire, investigating someone for inconsistencies like that... well, it just kinda sucks, doesn't it? I don't think we should expect people to have a consistent viewpoint across everything they've ever posted online.
neilpanchal 6y ago
lol that was satire, I didn't write it well enough :-) I absolutely adore HN's design. 100% serious!

dangus 6y ago

Let's make a new computing law: The likelihood of an opinion on UI changes to be an overreaction is inversely proportional to the length of time that has passed since their release.

ogre_codes 6y ago

> I want macOS that has a UI of Windows 95. That would be totally insane on Apple Silicon. WTF? I mean I get most of what you said until that. I vastly prefer the Catalina and every version of MacOS over the past 15 years versus anything out of Redmond, and particularly not W95. (Heck I used Window Maker prior to MacOS, my love for Next ancestors goes back some time) I hear a lot of people are frustrated with Big Sur. Hopefully Apple will dial back a lot of the egregious UI updates. They frequently go big on new redesigns, then dial things back. Hopefully.