5 ms·

Hehe, I remember my first train journey in the US. I believe it was Philly to NYC. I remember thinking "hey, what are they complaining about!? This is totally f

by gspr 6y ago

Hehe, I remember my first train journey in the US. I believe it was Philly to NYC. I remember thinking "hey, what are they complaining about!? This is totally fine!" before I was told that together with like one other corridor like this in California(?), that's essentially full the extent of usable US rail service?

prox 6y ago
I wonder if Joe Biden “Amtrak Joe” will make a change, since he is such a big fan of trains.
- ghaff 6y ago
  Well, no. And one wonders to what degree Amtrak plans will be pushed out because of the plunge in travel. It's also easy to be a fan of trains if you live in the Northeast Corridor. More or less uniquely in the US other than a handful of other city pairs.
vmception 6y ago
That's the full extent of tolerable long distance commuter rail service. The issue is that it can't be modernized to be faster and quieter in an economical way. Actually the issue is that its too uneconomical to do so, the current trains are not economical. This is whether we are referring to that high traffic corridor or to anywhere else.
- ghaff 6y ago
  The NE Corridor is actually profitable for Amtrak (in normal times). The problem is that Amtrak then proceeds to lose its NE Corridor profits on pretty much every other train route in the country.
  - volkl48 6y ago
    Amtrak basically is 3 different types of services, especially after PRRIA 2008 changed the funding structure. - Northeast Corridor - Makes a solid operating profit (normally), run by Amtrak. - State-supported corridor services - The states are basically paying the subsidy required to run the service and deciding what they want. If the state wants to upgrade the line for faster service, run more trains, etc, and they want to pay for it, Amtrak will run it. In some cases, the states (WA + CA come to mind) own or part-own the equipment being run as well. This is most other "practical" services (NY Empire Service, WA/OR Cascades, etc) and where you're seeing most improvements/investments. - Long-distance network - They run once a day or less, they're where most of the hours/days late horror stories come from, they almost all lose money, federal government pays and dictates that they run it. Mostly impractical as transportation for people who have any other option for how to get somewhere. That said, the loss isn't that big as a financial number (in part, because there's not that much service), and it's basically a matter of political calculus as well....lots of rural senators who sign off on Amtrak funding in substantial part because of their one or two trains a day.
- bluGill 6y ago
  As rail advocates point out, it could be modernized in an economical way. However the leaders don't care to. They decide a station that isn't accessible needs to be completely rebuilt into a palace instead of adding a few ramps. And many other similar things where what could be done cheap if they wanted get ballooned into large payments to do something expensive but not really needed.
xadhominemx 6y ago
Not a coincidence, really. The NE corridor is the only area in the US that has Europe-like population density.
bojan 6y ago
For California, travelling on a Zephyr line from Los Angeles to San Diego was a very pleasant experience.
steveklabnik 6y ago
One weird wrinkle here that nobody has mentioned yet: In the US, freight trains have priority over passenger trains. As far as I know, generally in Europe it's the opposite.
- ghaff 6y ago
  Why understanding is that isn't quite true (though I may be wrong). I've been told that Amtrak does have scheduled slots but, if they miss the slot, they're now at the mercy of the freight trains. And the rail network in most of the country is optimized for freight trains which can be extremely long and slow.

by gspr 6y ago

prox 6y ago

I wonder if Joe Biden “Amtrak Joe” will make a change, since he is such a big fan of trains.

ghaff 6y ago
Well, no. And one wonders to what degree Amtrak plans will be pushed out because of the plunge in travel. It's also easy to be a fan of trains if you live in the Northeast Corridor. More or less uniquely in the US other than a handful of other city pairs.

vmception 6y ago

That's the full extent of tolerable long distance commuter rail service. The issue is that it can't be modernized to be faster and quieter in an economical way. Actually the issue is that its too uneconomical to do so, the current trains are not economical. This is whether we are referring to that high traffic corridor or to anywhere else.

ghaff 6y ago
The NE Corridor is actually profitable for Amtrak (in normal times). The problem is that Amtrak then proceeds to lose its NE Corridor profits on pretty much every other train route in the country.
- volkl48 6y ago
  Amtrak basically is 3 different types of services, especially after PRRIA 2008 changed the funding structure. - Northeast Corridor - Makes a solid operating profit (normally), run by Amtrak. - State-supported corridor services - The states are basically paying the subsidy required to run the service and deciding what they want. If the state wants to upgrade the line for faster service, run more trains, etc, and they want to pay for it, Amtrak will run it. In some cases, the states (WA + CA come to mind) own or part-own the equipment being run as well. This is most other "practical" services (NY Empire Service, WA/OR Cascades, etc) and where you're seeing most improvements/investments. - Long-distance network - They run once a day or less, they're where most of the hours/days late horror stories come from, they almost all lose money, federal government pays and dictates that they run it. Mostly impractical as transportation for people who have any other option for how to get somewhere. That said, the loss isn't that big as a financial number (in part, because there's not that much service), and it's basically a matter of political calculus as well....lots of rural senators who sign off on Amtrak funding in substantial part because of their one or two trains a day.
bluGill 6y ago
As rail advocates point out, it could be modernized in an economical way. However the leaders don't care to. They decide a station that isn't accessible needs to be completely rebuilt into a palace instead of adding a few ramps. And many other similar things where what could be done cheap if they wanted get ballooned into large payments to do something expensive but not really needed.

xadhominemx 6y ago

Not a coincidence, really. The NE corridor is the only area in the US that has Europe-like population density.

bojan 6y ago

For California, travelling on a Zephyr line from Los Angeles to San Diego was a very pleasant experience.

steveklabnik 6y ago

One weird wrinkle here that nobody has mentioned yet: In the US, freight trains have priority over passenger trains. As far as I know, generally in Europe it's the opposite.

ghaff 6y ago
Why understanding is that isn't quite true (though I may be wrong). I've been told that Amtrak does have scheduled slots but, if they miss the slot, they're now at the mercy of the freight trains. And the rail network in most of the country is optimized for freight trains which can be extremely long and slow.