4 ms·

If there is a distrust in government misusing taxes, i wonder why the solution is to have less taxes, as opposed to fixing the government? I'm not being snarky

If there is a distrust in government misusing taxes, i wonder why the solution is to have less taxes, as opposed to fixing the government? I'm not being snarky I'm just genuinely curious why that is the knee jerk reaction.

zepto 6y ago
Fixing the government isn’t a ‘solution’. It’s a generally unsolved problem.
- MagnumOpus 6y ago
  It's a problem that is solved much better in many other similarly-wealthy countries (see Norway, Switzerland) or pretty much all the other first world countries. It does not have to be perfect, it only has to be better.
  - Buttons840 6y ago
    It's a good answer to the question though. The comment isn't necessarily in support of low taxes, but you have to admit "did I pay less tax?" is much easier to answer than "is the government functioning well?"
  - ericmay 6y ago
    Most of those countries have very homogenous populations. You also don’t hear about the bad stuff because unliked the United States they don’t have their dirty laundry being broadcast across every available medium 24/7/365.
    - sangli 6y ago
      What are you getting at? How is having homogeneous population causes less corruption in government? There are many asian and african countries with homogeneous population that are extremely corrupt. Other countries do have 24/7 TV channels and other media.
      - eggy 6y ago
        I think the assessment should be paired variables of homogeneous populations AND small populations, since countries in Asia and Africa are counter examples, however, Denmark and other countries touted as good examples are both homogeneous and small in population compared to the US.
      - ericmay 6y ago
        > Other countries do have 24/7 TV channels and other media. Yea and they spend most of that time complaining about Trump. And if they aren't, then people will go to Reddit, or some social media site to do it. > What are you getting at? Countries with small, homogeneous populations are going to tend to be less corrupt and better governed. It's more difficult to be a jackass in Iceland than it is in Brasil.
    - deleted 6y ago
      [deleted]
    - 0max 6y ago
      How about Singapore?
      - ericmay 6y ago
        It's a small city state that's 74% Chinese [1]. Not very multi-cultural in the western sense. Take a look at France for example. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Demographics_of_Singapore https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Demographics_of_Singapore -edit- You can also be multi-cultural in the "look at my skin color sense" but not multi-cultural in your beliefs. And of course for the purposes of this discussion it's a matter of degrees. Locally there may be extremes, but when you compare different geographies that might highlight actual extremes. I'm willing to bet, for example, that the United States is far more diverse both in opinion and nationality than Singapore. Iceland? Less so.
  - refurb 6y ago
    Aren’t taxes quite low in Switzerland? Or at least in some Cantons?
  - zepto 6y ago
    The problem is not solved by answering the question ‘does any country appear to have a better government?’. The problem is solved by answering the question: ‘what mechanism will transform our current government to a better one?’ That is unsolved.
zucker42 6y ago
There's a major ideological divide over whether fixing the government is possible.
- hunter-gatherer 6y ago
  I worked in government for 5 years. I don't think it can be fixed.
- cpursley 6y ago
  Swap government with "big monopolistic corporation" and it begins to make sense why reform of large human organizations while not impossible, is an uphill battle.
logicchains 6y ago
>If there is a distrust in government misusing taxes, i wonder why the solution is to have less taxes, as opposed to fixing the government? Because it's a lot easier to reduce taxes (simply change tax law) than to fix the government? Especially if the government is corrupt, and wouldn't take too kindly to people trying to "fix" it.
- wolfram74 6y ago
  If the government is corrupt, I interpret that as they're there for money and power(often in the form of how to spend the money), why is it is easier to get rid of the reason to be in a corrupt government than to change some of the members of said government? Feels like it'd be of comparable difficulty.
dcolkitt 6y ago
Who’s to say that cutting taxes isn’t the best route to fixing the government. When institutions are systematically overfunded they tend to grow fat and entitled. Ironically they end up doing less with more. Trimming the budget enforces discipline and builds institutional knowledge around how to operate lean and execute efficiently.
- FuckButtons 6y ago
  This doesn’t happen with business so why do you think it works with government? Do cash strapped companies routinely outperform their well funded competition? No, generally they get acquired or go under.
indymike 6y ago
It's a good question, and much of it comes from this: most people don't agree on what the government should do with taxes, especially at the detailed implementation level. Also, as you tax people, well, freedom isn't very useful without the financial means to exercise said freedom.

zepto 6y ago

Fixing the government isn’t a ‘solution’. It’s a generally unsolved problem.

MagnumOpus 6y ago
It's a problem that is solved much better in many other similarly-wealthy countries (see Norway, Switzerland) or pretty much all the other first world countries. It does not have to be perfect, it only has to be better.
- Buttons840 6y ago
  It's a good answer to the question though. The comment isn't necessarily in support of low taxes, but you have to admit "did I pay less tax?" is much easier to answer than "is the government functioning well?"
- ericmay 6y ago
  Most of those countries have very homogenous populations. You also don’t hear about the bad stuff because unliked the United States they don’t have their dirty laundry being broadcast across every available medium 24/7/365.
  - sangli 6y ago
    What are you getting at? How is having homogeneous population causes less corruption in government? There are many asian and african countries with homogeneous population that are extremely corrupt. Other countries do have 24/7 TV channels and other media.
    - eggy 6y ago
      I think the assessment should be paired variables of homogeneous populations AND small populations, since countries in Asia and Africa are counter examples, however, Denmark and other countries touted as good examples are both homogeneous and small in population compared to the US.
    - ericmay 6y ago
      > Other countries do have 24/7 TV channels and other media. Yea and they spend most of that time complaining about Trump. And if they aren't, then people will go to Reddit, or some social media site to do it. > What are you getting at? Countries with small, homogeneous populations are going to tend to be less corrupt and better governed. It's more difficult to be a jackass in Iceland than it is in Brasil.
  - deleted 6y ago
    [deleted]
  - 0max 6y ago
    How about Singapore?
    - ericmay 6y ago
      It's a small city state that's 74% Chinese [1]. Not very multi-cultural in the western sense. Take a look at France for example. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Demographics_of_Singapore https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Demographics_of_Singapore -edit- You can also be multi-cultural in the "look at my skin color sense" but not multi-cultural in your beliefs. And of course for the purposes of this discussion it's a matter of degrees. Locally there may be extremes, but when you compare different geographies that might highlight actual extremes. I'm willing to bet, for example, that the United States is far more diverse both in opinion and nationality than Singapore. Iceland? Less so.
- refurb 6y ago
  Aren’t taxes quite low in Switzerland? Or at least in some Cantons?
- zepto 6y ago
  The problem is not solved by answering the question ‘does any country appear to have a better government?’. The problem is solved by answering the question: ‘what mechanism will transform our current government to a better one?’ That is unsolved.

zucker42 6y ago

There's a major ideological divide over whether fixing the government is possible.

hunter-gatherer 6y ago
I worked in government for 5 years. I don't think it can be fixed.
cpursley 6y ago
Swap government with "big monopolistic corporation" and it begins to make sense why reform of large human organizations while not impossible, is an uphill battle.

logicchains 6y ago

>If there is a distrust in government misusing taxes, i wonder why the solution is to have less taxes, as opposed to fixing the government? Because it's a lot easier to reduce taxes (simply change tax law) than to fix the government? Especially if the government is corrupt, and wouldn't take too kindly to people trying to "fix" it.

wolfram74 6y ago
If the government is corrupt, I interpret that as they're there for money and power(often in the form of how to spend the money), why is it is easier to get rid of the reason to be in a corrupt government than to change some of the members of said government? Feels like it'd be of comparable difficulty.

dcolkitt 6y ago

Who’s to say that cutting taxes isn’t the best route to fixing the government. When institutions are systematically overfunded they tend to grow fat and entitled. Ironically they end up doing less with more. Trimming the budget enforces discipline and builds institutional knowledge around how to operate lean and execute efficiently.

FuckButtons 6y ago
This doesn’t happen with business so why do you think it works with government? Do cash strapped companies routinely outperform their well funded competition? No, generally they get acquired or go under.

indymike 6y ago

It's a good question, and much of it comes from this: most people don't agree on what the government should do with taxes, especially at the detailed implementation level. Also, as you tax people, well, freedom isn't very useful without the financial means to exercise said freedom.