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Or maybe this insane nonsense has become so powerful because the official narratives are much dumber than I seem to remember them from before. Probably a result

Or maybe this insane nonsense has become so powerful because the official narratives are much dumber than I seem to remember them from before. Probably a result of both increasing polarization and shrinking media budgets. For example, covid is just the flu, and only xenophobes would enact travel bans over it. No wait, corona is terrible and it's Trump's fault for not containing it. No wait, we should all go to BLM protests, did you know they actually _lower_ Covid rates? Listen to the science, don't wear masks! No wait, wear masks! ... (The most effective "alt-right"/trust erosion accounts I've seen don't do much more than put screenshots of contradictory statements from the same source next to each other.) Or Pizzagate, where it felt like the official narrative had solidly won after someone wanted to raid the pedophile dungeon and couldn't find it. Case closed! Until the Epstein story happened, Clinton's name was on flight list several times, and the media acted in actual unison by ignoring the implications. (I get it! Touching this case is suicide by proxy for journalists. But then don't blame normies for getting paranoid about pedophile elites.)

dragonwriter 6y ago
> Or Pizzagate, where it felt like the official narrative had solidly won after someone wanted to raid the pedophile dungeon and couldn't find it. Case closed! Until the Epstein story happened, Clinton's name was on the flight list several times, and the media acted in actual unison by ignoring this case. Er, the Epstein and Clinton connection first arose before Pizzagate, and it covered in the mainstream media. It then arose again when Epstein was charged the last time, and even more widely reported by the mainstream media. And it arose again very recently in the context of the Ghislaine Maxwell case, and, is right now being extensively covered in the mainstream media. This isn't a matter of cherry-picking facts to spin a conspiracy theory around and just ignoring facts that contradict the theory, it's inventing false facts to justify a conspiracy theory (which is then used to place blame for belief in other conspiracy theories.)
- gurkendoktor 6y ago
  I had edited my comment while you were replying. The media did not "ignore the case", sorry. There are plenty of articles about Epstein and Maxwell, and Prince Andrew didn't get away either. But that's about it, isn't it? Everyone else who hung out with them just has to say "whoops, I totally didn't know about their pedo side", and that's the end of the story. Which is amazing when even low-level socialites like Ellen Pao were apparently aware of Maxwell's side business. Where was the pressure from journalists on law enforcement, and from law enforcement on those involved? Too late now anyway, I guess? For what it's worth, my own pessimism is mostly based on the disastrous Dutroux case over here in Europe. If 27 witnesses can get killed over what is presumably a much lower-profile pedophile ring, then what chance do we have to ever know about the depth of Epstein's connections, or even just his death? (I'd love to be proven wrong!) I'm not saying that this validates any particular conspiracy theory (I agree with [1]), but that it highlighted an immense imbalance of power and transparency between the 0.001% and the rest of us. Epstein was a comic-book villain walking free. I believe that if the media can make it clear that they're fighting _for us_, people won't look to QAnon for salvation. [1] https://nymag.com/intelligencer/2019/07/does-the-jeffrey-epstein-indictment-qanon.html https://nymag.com/intelligencer/2019/07/does-the-jeffrey-eps...
  - AndrewBissell 6y ago
    > I'm not saying that this validates any particular conspiracy theory (I agree with [1]), but that it highlighted an immense imbalance of power and transparency between the 0.001% and the rest of us. Epstein was a comic-book villain walking free. I believe that if the media can make it clear that they're fighting _for us_, people won't look to QAnon for salvation. QFT. Epstein's death, and the way the media immediately circled the wagons to browbeat anyone questioning its circumstances with charges of "baseless conspiracy theory," was basically the decisive factor in my switching from a Skeptic-reading blanket conspiracy doubter to someone who takes a pretty wide number of theories seriously. The media hasn't even bothered asking the FBI why they haven't raided Epstein's New Mexico ranch. Whether that's an explicit directive from on high or they just instinctively know where their bread is buttered, it's clear whose side they're on.

dragonwriter 6y ago

> Or Pizzagate, where it felt like the official narrative had solidly won after someone wanted to raid the pedophile dungeon and couldn't find it. Case closed! Until the Epstein story happened, Clinton's name was on the flight list several times, and the media acted in actual unison by ignoring this case. Er, the Epstein and Clinton connection first arose before Pizzagate, and it covered in the mainstream media. It then arose again when Epstein was charged the last time, and even more widely reported by the mainstream media. And it arose again very recently in the context of the Ghislaine Maxwell case, and, is right now being extensively covered in the mainstream media. This isn't a matter of cherry-picking facts to spin a conspiracy theory around and just ignoring facts that contradict the theory, it's inventing false facts to justify a conspiracy theory (which is then used to place blame for belief in other conspiracy theories.)

gurkendoktor 6y ago
I had edited my comment while you were replying. The media did not "ignore the case", sorry. There are plenty of articles about Epstein and Maxwell, and Prince Andrew didn't get away either. But that's about it, isn't it? Everyone else who hung out with them just has to say "whoops, I totally didn't know about their pedo side", and that's the end of the story. Which is amazing when even low-level socialites like Ellen Pao were apparently aware of Maxwell's side business. Where was the pressure from journalists on law enforcement, and from law enforcement on those involved? Too late now anyway, I guess? For what it's worth, my own pessimism is mostly based on the disastrous Dutroux case over here in Europe. If 27 witnesses can get killed over what is presumably a much lower-profile pedophile ring, then what chance do we have to ever know about the depth of Epstein's connections, or even just his death? (I'd love to be proven wrong!) I'm not saying that this validates any particular conspiracy theory (I agree with [1]), but that it highlighted an immense imbalance of power and transparency between the 0.001% and the rest of us. Epstein was a comic-book villain walking free. I believe that if the media can make it clear that they're fighting _for us_, people won't look to QAnon for salvation. [1] https://nymag.com/intelligencer/2019/07/does-the-jeffrey-epstein-indictment-qanon.html https://nymag.com/intelligencer/2019/07/does-the-jeffrey-eps...
- AndrewBissell 6y ago
  > I'm not saying that this validates any particular conspiracy theory (I agree with [1]), but that it highlighted an immense imbalance of power and transparency between the 0.001% and the rest of us. Epstein was a comic-book villain walking free. I believe that if the media can make it clear that they're fighting _for us_, people won't look to QAnon for salvation. QFT. Epstein's death, and the way the media immediately circled the wagons to browbeat anyone questioning its circumstances with charges of "baseless conspiracy theory," was basically the decisive factor in my switching from a Skeptic-reading blanket conspiracy doubter to someone who takes a pretty wide number of theories seriously. The media hasn't even bothered asking the FBI why they haven't raided Epstein's New Mexico ranch. Whether that's an explicit directive from on high or they just instinctively know where their bread is buttered, it's clear whose side they're on.