4 ms·

Luckily my Toyota has an option to disable this remote proximity bullshit all together. I need to press button on the keys to unlock the car, and I need to put

Luckily my Toyota has an option to disable this remote proximity bullshit all together. I need to press button on the keys to unlock the car, and I need to put the keys on the start button to get it to start the engine.

londons_explore 6y ago
> the keys on the start button to get it to start the engine So it's wireless... So someone can still use a relay attack to send the signal from the start button to the keys hanging up by your front door...
- gray_-_wolf 6y ago
  It works only short-while after pressing the button. If I take too much time setting my stuff in the car I need to press the unlock button again to "wake up" the keys in order for it to work. So I believe it should be good enough against relay attack.
- iso1631 6y ago
  Anyone remember the days when you used to put the key in the ignition?
  - gray_-_wolf 6y ago
    I remember my father having a car like that :D
  - yellowapple 6y ago
    Yeah, this is exactly why I'll be buying used pretty much forever. Don't trust self-driving anything, don't trust wireless/remote start, don't trust half-baked services like OnStar... if it gets to the point where ICEs are outright illegal, then I'd sooner convert an old beat-up Tacoma or 4Runner to an electric drivetrain than buy new. The only exception is if I have full control over it, including the ability to lock it down. No OTA updates; if I want to install security patches, it'll be through Ethernet or USB or some other wired connection. But preferably, there wouldn't be a whole lot of software to update in the first place.
  - brianwawok 6y ago
    Sounds like a lot of work
  - z6 6y ago
    Yep, and I also remember someone still managed to steal our car. Different times, different methods.
    - iso1631 6y ago
      I had a 1997 Micra about a decade ago, lost the key. Had someone come out, they could get in easily enough, but couldn't get it started without the original key. Had to go to dealer to get one programmed. That seems to me to be far more secure than a modern tesla. There's far less chance of leaving your key in the car if you have to press the lock button on the fob after you get out -- done that on hire cars before. The key is always in the same place. Conversely you can leave the key in the ignition if you're popping into the store to pay for the gas and leaving your passengers in the car. I had a keyless fob on another hire car in my pocket, alarm went off when I went into the store. I don't get the appeal of keyless.

londons_explore 6y ago

> the keys on the start button to get it to start the engine So it's wireless... So someone can still use a relay attack to send the signal from the start button to the keys hanging up by your front door...

gray_-_wolf 6y ago
It works only short-while after pressing the button. If I take too much time setting my stuff in the car I need to press the unlock button again to "wake up" the keys in order for it to work. So I believe it should be good enough against relay attack.
iso1631 6y ago
Anyone remember the days when you used to put the key in the ignition?
- gray_-_wolf 6y ago
  I remember my father having a car like that :D
- yellowapple 6y ago
  Yeah, this is exactly why I'll be buying used pretty much forever. Don't trust self-driving anything, don't trust wireless/remote start, don't trust half-baked services like OnStar... if it gets to the point where ICEs are outright illegal, then I'd sooner convert an old beat-up Tacoma or 4Runner to an electric drivetrain than buy new. The only exception is if I have full control over it, including the ability to lock it down. No OTA updates; if I want to install security patches, it'll be through Ethernet or USB or some other wired connection. But preferably, there wouldn't be a whole lot of software to update in the first place.
- brianwawok 6y ago
  Sounds like a lot of work
- z6 6y ago
  Yep, and I also remember someone still managed to steal our car. Different times, different methods.
  - iso1631 6y ago
    I had a 1997 Micra about a decade ago, lost the key. Had someone come out, they could get in easily enough, but couldn't get it started without the original key. Had to go to dealer to get one programmed. That seems to me to be far more secure than a modern tesla. There's far less chance of leaving your key in the car if you have to press the lock button on the fob after you get out -- done that on hire cars before. The key is always in the same place. Conversely you can leave the key in the ignition if you're popping into the store to pay for the gas and leaving your passengers in the car. I had a keyless fob on another hire car in my pocket, alarm went off when I went into the store. I don't get the appeal of keyless.