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I may have witnessed something similar. Pre-covid, I used to walk to work for several years. The shortest route took me through a parking lot for a large state

I may have witnessed something similar. Pre-covid, I used to walk to work for several years. The shortest route took me through a parking lot for a large state office building. In the mornings, I would often see people sitting in their cars--reading, smoking, listening to the radio, whatever--but pointedly not going inside the building, at least not yet. And it was like this every day, not just occasionally. Some people were very consistent and I would see them nearly every day. I've worked in various places, all private sector, and I couldn't remember ever seeing anything like this before. It finally occurred to me that perhaps they were deliberately waiting until the exact time when they were expected to be present to actually enter the building. The implication being that they'd prefer to sit in their cars rather than start their work day even a few minutes early. Edit: Which, to be clear, is perfectly fine as far as I'm concerned--I just had never seen or done anything like that before, and I've also never worked directly for a government agency.

bobthepanda 6y ago
Practically speaking, when I worked for the state this was because only a few managers actually had the keys to the office, so if you showed up early you would be sitting in the hallway.
Fnoord 6y ago
> The implication being that they'd prefer to sit in their cars rather than start their work day even a few minutes early. If you're supposed to work from 9 to 5, why would you start earlier if it doesn't benefit you to do so? If your work starts with a team meeting, why enter at 8.45? You could, but my experience is people want you to socialize then. For me (I am autistic) that's draining, not energizing. When I worked for Dutch equiv. to IRS, we had to be logged in at 9, not enter the building at 9. With Windows NT and everyone logging in at the same time this meant you had to start your computer at 8.50 or you'd be too late. I only hike quick, so I was logged in on time (even had time for a cig). Either way, they'd mainly look at the performance reports.
- treis 6y ago
  >If you're supposed to work from 9 to 5, why would you start earlier if it doesn't benefit you to do so? This goes to the GP. A government worker doesn't see any benefit. They're career is basically seniority driven if there's any advancement at all. A private sector employee would be noted for their extra effort and see a bigger bonus/be promoted.
slyall 6y ago
It could be that they have left for work early to avoid the traffic. ie if their start time is 9am then they could leave at 8am and take an hour, or leave at 7:30am, take 30 minutes and then spend an hour in their car reading. Plenty of firms have fixed hours so you gain nothing by starting early. The office might not even be open for employees to come in early.
proverbialbunny 6y ago
It might be because their computers are monitored so they're not comfortable goofing off if they come in 15 minutes early?
gtfoutttt 6y ago
Or they were told that if they logged in early then they would automatically get OT and that's not allowed. That happened to a friend who works for the state.
- BlueTemplar 6y ago
  They couldn't leave early ?
  - qu-everything 6y ago
    Dunno about that job, but at mine, it's important somebody is there at the end of the day, I can't just leave early because I got there early
throwaway201103 6y ago
I've found myself doing this about 10 or so years ago. Very literally sitting in my car, staring out the window at the office front door, gathering the will to get out and go inside. Not in government work either, this was a private sector SaaS company. Started about 6 months after my employer adopted Agile development. Came to realize it was the signal that I was sick of what my job had become, sick of the ceremonial routines, sick of feeling like a generic cog in a machine, and that I needed to start looking at alternatives.
- shostack 6y ago
  What about agile did that?
  - goatinaboat 6y ago
    What about agile did that? Probably the bit where you need to justify your existence every morning in front of your peers and management. “I spent the day learning” doesn’t go down well, there is pressure to be seen to be busy all the time. Programmers think Agile is for them, but it’s for the benefit of management, always was.
agumonkey 6y ago
There's a plausible alternative interpretation.. many many people in public sector enjoy not being pressured, not because they're lazy or sad, but because they'd rather respect themselves first. In the private sector, your job is on the line, the burden is on you and you'll have to bend over to avoid being fired.. it may not necessarily be sane motivation driving people to enter the building.

bobthepanda 6y ago

Practically speaking, when I worked for the state this was because only a few managers actually had the keys to the office, so if you showed up early you would be sitting in the hallway.

Fnoord 6y ago

> The implication being that they'd prefer to sit in their cars rather than start their work day even a few minutes early. If you're supposed to work from 9 to 5, why would you start earlier if it doesn't benefit you to do so? If your work starts with a team meeting, why enter at 8.45? You could, but my experience is people want you to socialize then. For me (I am autistic) that's draining, not energizing. When I worked for Dutch equiv. to IRS, we had to be logged in at 9, not enter the building at 9. With Windows NT and everyone logging in at the same time this meant you had to start your computer at 8.50 or you'd be too late. I only hike quick, so I was logged in on time (even had time for a cig). Either way, they'd mainly look at the performance reports.

treis 6y ago
>If you're supposed to work from 9 to 5, why would you start earlier if it doesn't benefit you to do so? This goes to the GP. A government worker doesn't see any benefit. They're career is basically seniority driven if there's any advancement at all. A private sector employee would be noted for their extra effort and see a bigger bonus/be promoted.

slyall 6y ago

It could be that they have left for work early to avoid the traffic. ie if their start time is 9am then they could leave at 8am and take an hour, or leave at 7:30am, take 30 minutes and then spend an hour in their car reading. Plenty of firms have fixed hours so you gain nothing by starting early. The office might not even be open for employees to come in early.

proverbialbunny 6y ago

It might be because their computers are monitored so they're not comfortable goofing off if they come in 15 minutes early?

gtfoutttt 6y ago

Or they were told that if they logged in early then they would automatically get OT and that's not allowed. That happened to a friend who works for the state.

BlueTemplar 6y ago
They couldn't leave early ?
- qu-everything 6y ago
  Dunno about that job, but at mine, it's important somebody is there at the end of the day, I can't just leave early because I got there early

throwaway201103 6y ago

I've found myself doing this about 10 or so years ago. Very literally sitting in my car, staring out the window at the office front door, gathering the will to get out and go inside. Not in government work either, this was a private sector SaaS company. Started about 6 months after my employer adopted Agile development. Came to realize it was the signal that I was sick of what my job had become, sick of the ceremonial routines, sick of feeling like a generic cog in a machine, and that I needed to start looking at alternatives.

shostack 6y ago
What about agile did that?
- goatinaboat 6y ago
  What about agile did that? Probably the bit where you need to justify your existence every morning in front of your peers and management. “I spent the day learning” doesn’t go down well, there is pressure to be seen to be busy all the time. Programmers think Agile is for them, but it’s for the benefit of management, always was.

agumonkey 6y ago

There's a plausible alternative interpretation.. many many people in public sector enjoy not being pressured, not because they're lazy or sad, but because they'd rather respect themselves first. In the private sector, your job is on the line, the burden is on you and you'll have to bend over to avoid being fired.. it may not necessarily be sane motivation driving people to enter the building.