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I was accepted to Cornell as an undergrad, but my family couldn't afford it, so I had to go to a state university instead, with in-state tuition. My scores didn

by _qulr 6y ago

I was accepted to Cornell as an undergrad, but my family couldn't afford it, so I had to go to a state university instead, with in-state tuition. My scores didn't even matter without the money.

glial 6y ago
Same here, but Reed and University of Chicago.
awat 6y ago
I wonder how common this story is, my brother was accepted to Penn but our family didn’t have the money. We both ended up at large state schools getting honors degrees. The whole decision making process for us was money based not merit based.
- _qulr 6y ago
  My high school friend was accepted to MIT, couldn't afford it, and also went to a state university. So that's 3!
  - fakedang 6y ago
    Got accepted at Berkeley, didn't get a scholarship that I needed, ended up studying in India instead. To be fair, you can always go to MIT or any top notch university for a graduate/second undergrad degree, but you can only go to IIT/NIT once.
  - jjoonathan 6y ago
    Usually big-name schools have high price tags but extremely generous financial aid. MIT: > Six out of every 10 students receive MIT need-based aid. the average price paid by an undergraduate receiving financial aid in 2019–2020 was $21,917—that’s approximately what it costs to attend a state school. And for students with family incomes under $90,000 a year, we ensure that scholarship funding will allow them to attend MIT tuition-free. Harvard puts the following numbers front and center: 20 % of Harvard families pay nothing 55 % receive Harvard scholarship aid 12 K average parent contribution 100 % of students can graduate debt-free Other schools in this tier have similar policies.
    - _qulr 6y ago
      This was many years ago. Maybe it's better now, but far too late for us! Also, wow, state school is a lot more expensive than in my day.
    - musicale 6y ago
      > 100 % of students can graduate debt-free Can graduate debt-free, or do actually graduate debt-free? This also seems to ignore parental debt. Many parents cannot afford to pay $12K a year (or more) and have to take out home equity or other loans in order to pay the parental contribution that the university financial aid office decides upon. Does this include graduate and professional students? And what about "big-name" schools that don't have Harvard's $41B endowment? Some monetarily "poorer" ivies (Dartmouth and Brown) have endowments that are tiny by comparison (though $6B or $5B isn't exactly chump change. Also they had terrific returns of 8% and 12% for 2020.)
axaxs 6y ago
Same story, but Yale and a couple others. Had a great SAT score, national merit scholar, yada yada. The big names don't even offer academic scholarships. There's not a chance in hell my family or I could have afforded it. Edit: Not to be misleading - I hadn't been accepted as I never applied. The below replies are based on talks with recruiters prior to applying, which I ultimately never did.
- matthewowen 6y ago
  When was this? Yale offers need blind admissions and full aid to those who need it - that's why they don't offer academic scholarships.
  - axaxs 6y ago
    2003. They called me unsolicited and talked for an hour. He specifically said they didn't offer academic scholarships, and that perhaps I could join something like crew and go for a scholarship that way.
    - an_opabinia 6y ago
      Do you wish you had taken out the loans?
      - axaxs 6y ago
        It is rare, but every couple years I do that big what if for different scenarios in life. Just for fun mostly, but it's hard not to get frustrated when your dream life is so much better. But no, I try to have no regrets. I know enough people saddled in student loan debt who didn't get their big shot. As an introvert, I could see that being me as I probably wouldn't have networked adequately. Then there's the whole fact that I would not have my wife and daughter likely. Very Butterfly Effect like thinking.
    - caddemon 6y ago
      Ivy league schools don't offer athletics scholarships, that's been a thing for ages and is part of the actual definition of "Ivy League".
akhilcacharya 6y ago
Sidenote, I ended up at a state school with in-state tuition but I didn't get into any top schools. Most of the studies that compare college rank to life outcomes track individuals that got accepted to elite schools but didn't go (like this subthread supports). What does this say about people like me? Am I on a lower track for life now? *Feels like people like me are underrepresented in conversations like this!
smallnamespace 6y ago
Just as a counter anecdote, I went to Cornell, and they offered a very generous aid package. Between loans and grants, about 80% of total costs were covered. No, I wasn't an athlete or some other special situation. Please don't avoid applying to a school just because you assume you won't be offered enough aid. Also, if an aid package doesn't work for you, please call the aid office to explain your situation. Tell them you want to attend, but money is the only barrier. They will work with you.
- an_opabinia 6y ago
  You don’t need aid! It is incredible any family says no to a top tier college program for any reason. It’s like winning the lottery. Taking out federal loans to pay to go to Cornell is still a fantastic deal, as long as you study the right things, even considering the loans are mispriced due to all the people who do not pay them back. It’s just basic arithmetic, so I cannot believe that the obstacle for families is knowledge of how the system works. Something else is always at play when people make completely drop dead stupid financial decisions, things that are usually personal and ancestral, deep problems that cannot be solved by arithmetic. On the financial flip side it’s also why people go into dentistry - the arithmetic is terrible considering how much dental school costs, but something about the relationship between the family and the kids is coercing kids into dental school anyway. This is not an unorthodox opinion.
  - deleted 6y ago
    [deleted]
- war1025 6y ago
  > Between loans and grants Just because you can get a loan to cover the cost doesn't mean it's affordable. I've noticed a definite difference between lower and middle income people in this regard. People without much income, "working class" if you will, view loans as "something to help make ends meet" More middle and upper-middle class people view loans as "access to cheap credit." I.e. ways to leverage a little excess money into a lot of excess money. The main difference is the level of confidence that the leverage isn't going to turn on you and flip your life upside-down because you can't make the payments.
bumby 6y ago
If it makes you feel any better, there's some research showing that the ability to be accepted is a better predictor for success than actually attending. I.e., students accepted to elite colleges who went to "lesser" schools had just as good of outcomes.* * There's a caveat that for those in the lowest incomes, attending mattered. I wonder if this is due to a networking effect rather than the quality of the school
thex10 6y ago
Accepted to MIT and given a generous financial aid package so I was able to attend (2006). I had been fully expecting to have to attend the local city college...
- wolco2 6y ago
  Have you paid it back? What was the total cost to you including financing charges. I find school's love to offer loans.
- akhilcacharya 6y ago
  As someone who was in the chosen set, what exactly do you recommend people that weren't as lucky do? Because it seems really hopeless right now!

by _qulr 6y ago

I was accepted to Cornell as an undergrad, but my family couldn't afford it, so I had to go to a state university instead, with in-state tuition. My scores didn't even matter without the money.

glial 6y ago

Same here, but Reed and University of Chicago.

awat 6y ago

I wonder how common this story is, my brother was accepted to Penn but our family didn’t have the money. We both ended up at large state schools getting honors degrees. The whole decision making process for us was money based not merit based.

_qulr 6y ago
My high school friend was accepted to MIT, couldn't afford it, and also went to a state university. So that's 3!
- fakedang 6y ago
  Got accepted at Berkeley, didn't get a scholarship that I needed, ended up studying in India instead. To be fair, you can always go to MIT or any top notch university for a graduate/second undergrad degree, but you can only go to IIT/NIT once.
- jjoonathan 6y ago
  Usually big-name schools have high price tags but extremely generous financial aid. MIT: > Six out of every 10 students receive MIT need-based aid. the average price paid by an undergraduate receiving financial aid in 2019–2020 was $21,917—that’s approximately what it costs to attend a state school. And for students with family incomes under $90,000 a year, we ensure that scholarship funding will allow them to attend MIT tuition-free. Harvard puts the following numbers front and center: 20 % of Harvard families pay nothing 55 % receive Harvard scholarship aid 12 K average parent contribution 100 % of students can graduate debt-free Other schools in this tier have similar policies.
  - _qulr 6y ago
    This was many years ago. Maybe it's better now, but far too late for us! Also, wow, state school is a lot more expensive than in my day.
  - musicale 6y ago
    > 100 % of students can graduate debt-free Can graduate debt-free, or do actually graduate debt-free? This also seems to ignore parental debt. Many parents cannot afford to pay $12K a year (or more) and have to take out home equity or other loans in order to pay the parental contribution that the university financial aid office decides upon. Does this include graduate and professional students? And what about "big-name" schools that don't have Harvard's $41B endowment? Some monetarily "poorer" ivies (Dartmouth and Brown) have endowments that are tiny by comparison (though $6B or $5B isn't exactly chump change. Also they had terrific returns of 8% and 12% for 2020.)

axaxs 6y ago

Same story, but Yale and a couple others. Had a great SAT score, national merit scholar, yada yada. The big names don't even offer academic scholarships. There's not a chance in hell my family or I could have afforded it. Edit: Not to be misleading - I hadn't been accepted as I never applied. The below replies are based on talks with recruiters prior to applying, which I ultimately never did.

matthewowen 6y ago
When was this? Yale offers need blind admissions and full aid to those who need it - that's why they don't offer academic scholarships.
- axaxs 6y ago
  2003. They called me unsolicited and talked for an hour. He specifically said they didn't offer academic scholarships, and that perhaps I could join something like crew and go for a scholarship that way.
  - an_opabinia 6y ago
    Do you wish you had taken out the loans?
    - axaxs 6y ago
      It is rare, but every couple years I do that big what if for different scenarios in life. Just for fun mostly, but it's hard not to get frustrated when your dream life is so much better. But no, I try to have no regrets. I know enough people saddled in student loan debt who didn't get their big shot. As an introvert, I could see that being me as I probably wouldn't have networked adequately. Then there's the whole fact that I would not have my wife and daughter likely. Very Butterfly Effect like thinking.
  - caddemon 6y ago
    Ivy league schools don't offer athletics scholarships, that's been a thing for ages and is part of the actual definition of "Ivy League".

akhilcacharya 6y ago

Sidenote, I ended up at a state school with in-state tuition but I didn't get into any top schools. Most of the studies that compare college rank to life outcomes track individuals that got accepted to elite schools but didn't go (like this subthread supports). What does this say about people like me? Am I on a lower track for life now? *Feels like people like me are underrepresented in conversations like this!

smallnamespace 6y ago

Just as a counter anecdote, I went to Cornell, and they offered a very generous aid package. Between loans and grants, about 80% of total costs were covered. No, I wasn't an athlete or some other special situation. Please don't avoid applying to a school just because you assume you won't be offered enough aid. Also, if an aid package doesn't work for you, please call the aid office to explain your situation. Tell them you want to attend, but money is the only barrier. They will work with you.

an_opabinia 6y ago
You don’t need aid! It is incredible any family says no to a top tier college program for any reason. It’s like winning the lottery. Taking out federal loans to pay to go to Cornell is still a fantastic deal, as long as you study the right things, even considering the loans are mispriced due to all the people who do not pay them back. It’s just basic arithmetic, so I cannot believe that the obstacle for families is knowledge of how the system works. Something else is always at play when people make completely drop dead stupid financial decisions, things that are usually personal and ancestral, deep problems that cannot be solved by arithmetic. On the financial flip side it’s also why people go into dentistry - the arithmetic is terrible considering how much dental school costs, but something about the relationship between the family and the kids is coercing kids into dental school anyway. This is not an unorthodox opinion.
- deleted 6y ago
  [deleted]
war1025 6y ago
> Between loans and grants Just because you can get a loan to cover the cost doesn't mean it's affordable. I've noticed a definite difference between lower and middle income people in this regard. People without much income, "working class" if you will, view loans as "something to help make ends meet" More middle and upper-middle class people view loans as "access to cheap credit." I.e. ways to leverage a little excess money into a lot of excess money. The main difference is the level of confidence that the leverage isn't going to turn on you and flip your life upside-down because you can't make the payments.

bumby 6y ago

If it makes you feel any better, there's some research showing that the ability to be accepted is a better predictor for success than actually attending. I.e., students accepted to elite colleges who went to "lesser" schools had just as good of outcomes.* * There's a caveat that for those in the lowest incomes, attending mattered. I wonder if this is due to a networking effect rather than the quality of the school

thex10 6y ago

Accepted to MIT and given a generous financial aid package so I was able to attend (2006). I had been fully expecting to have to attend the local city college...

wolco2 6y ago
Have you paid it back? What was the total cost to you including financing charges. I find school's love to offer loans.
akhilcacharya 6y ago
As someone who was in the chosen set, what exactly do you recommend people that weren't as lucky do? Because it seems really hopeless right now!