3 ms·

There is much anti-tipping sentiment in this thread, but customers have information about the quality of service that restaurant managers do not, so the ability

There is much anti-tipping sentiment in this thread, but customers have information about the quality of service that restaurant managers do not, so the ability to leave a large tip, small tip, or no tip at all should improve service on average.

ed25519FUUU 6y ago
It improves service if people who look like you tip a lot. If people who look like you don’t tip, it makes it worse.
mplanchard 6y ago
Or it breeds a horrific culture of obsequious, servile service, where you’re bothered every five minutes during your meal so that your server can ask if everything is still okay. I’ll take European style service any day of the week. Sure you have to get their attention when you need it, but they don’t rush you out and they only bother you when you want them to do so.
- Mediterraneo10 6y ago
  The waiter bothering you is not about trying to seem helpful in pursuit of more tips. It is because they want to nudge you to free up the table for the next customers. Sadly, this same culture of asking you every five minutes "Is everything OK/Can I get you something else" is spreading in Europe, because the business owner wants to boost turnover, ambience be damned. The centuries-old concept of the intellectual cafe in Central Europe where you could order just a coffee and then spend two hours at the table talking with your peers, is now dying out: the proprietor wants you to drink your coffee quickly and then either order more or get out. Sometimes the business owner intentionally plays bad pop music loudly, so that it becomes uncomfortable to maintain a conversation in the long term.
  - lotsofpulp 6y ago
    As rent prices increase, I can imagine it’s the only possibility. Merchant A calculated they can earn $x from y customers in a hours, so they can afford rent accordingly. Merchant B calculates they can earn more than $x by increasing the number of customers, therefore merchant B offers to pay a higher rent. Now they have to make sure sufficient customers (or sufficient revenue per customer per hour) is being met to afford the rent. Only solution would be to move to a place with lower rents, I think. Or start explicitly paying rent for your table at the cafe per unit of time, but that might be unsavory to most people.
    - bushin 6y ago
      https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anti-caf%C3%A9 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anti-caf%C3%A9
iguy 6y ago
Customers care about the whole package -- the location, the hours, the queue, the decor, the food, the music, the crowd. If they like it, they come back. If not, not. That's a 100% effect. The manager needs to control all of this. If they hire good waiters, you will enjoy good service. But you can't pick yours, and I don't think what you leave at the end is a particularly big lever for affecting the service you've already had.
kevincox 6y ago
If you want me to rate the waiter or service just leave a 1/5 scale and a pen on the table. I'm sure the numbers are also a lot more useful as they aren't affected by how generous of a tipper the patron is.

ed25519FUUU 6y ago

It improves service if people who look like you tip a lot. If people who look like you don’t tip, it makes it worse.

mplanchard 6y ago

Or it breeds a horrific culture of obsequious, servile service, where you’re bothered every five minutes during your meal so that your server can ask if everything is still okay. I’ll take European style service any day of the week. Sure you have to get their attention when you need it, but they don’t rush you out and they only bother you when you want them to do so.

Mediterraneo10 6y ago
The waiter bothering you is not about trying to seem helpful in pursuit of more tips. It is because they want to nudge you to free up the table for the next customers. Sadly, this same culture of asking you every five minutes "Is everything OK/Can I get you something else" is spreading in Europe, because the business owner wants to boost turnover, ambience be damned. The centuries-old concept of the intellectual cafe in Central Europe where you could order just a coffee and then spend two hours at the table talking with your peers, is now dying out: the proprietor wants you to drink your coffee quickly and then either order more or get out. Sometimes the business owner intentionally plays bad pop music loudly, so that it becomes uncomfortable to maintain a conversation in the long term.
- lotsofpulp 6y ago
  As rent prices increase, I can imagine it’s the only possibility. Merchant A calculated they can earn $x from y customers in a hours, so they can afford rent accordingly. Merchant B calculates they can earn more than $x by increasing the number of customers, therefore merchant B offers to pay a higher rent. Now they have to make sure sufficient customers (or sufficient revenue per customer per hour) is being met to afford the rent. Only solution would be to move to a place with lower rents, I think. Or start explicitly paying rent for your table at the cafe per unit of time, but that might be unsavory to most people.
  - bushin 6y ago
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anti-caf%C3%A9 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anti-caf%C3%A9

iguy 6y ago

Customers care about the whole package -- the location, the hours, the queue, the decor, the food, the music, the crowd. If they like it, they come back. If not, not. That's a 100% effect. The manager needs to control all of this. If they hire good waiters, you will enjoy good service. But you can't pick yours, and I don't think what you leave at the end is a particularly big lever for affecting the service you've already had.

kevincox 6y ago

If you want me to rate the waiter or service just leave a 1/5 scale and a pen on the table. I'm sure the numbers are also a lot more useful as they aren't affected by how generous of a tipper the patron is.