3 ms·

Roughly 25% of these disorders are "broadly defined schizophrenia." Should we change that diagnosis so we can blame those suffering for their own failures? Per

Roughly 25% of these disorders are "broadly defined schizophrenia." Should we change that diagnosis so we can blame those suffering for their own failures? Personally, I'd rather hope and strive to reduce the amount of people suffering from mental disorders rather then redefine them so they aren't "serious." Everyone should be entitled to the "resources and advantages" that prevent illness, not just the rich.

eplanit 6y ago
So, hospital for bumps and bruises, because they're just as serious as broken bones?
- boomboomsubban 6y ago
  No, provide all the children with the safety equipment that limits both bruises and broken bones rather than only give it to the wealthy children.
davidn20 6y ago
I don't understand why people think I'm against helping people. I'm not. I'm not trying to shame anyone. I'm simply saying, no matter your situation, do the best you can because that's what you have control over. Also, it's easier to change yourself, than to change the world. I mean if you're fighting to change the world, more power to you. I hope you succeed and make the world a fairer place.
- boomboomsubban 6y ago
  >I'm simply saying, no matter your situation, do the best you can because that's what you have control over. Also, it's easier to change yourself, than to change the world Again, you're telling this to people with mental disorders like schizophrenia. They don't necessarily have control over their disorder, and are unable to change themselves alone. This is why it seems like you're shaming people. You both belittled their issues and are telling them to just get over them, like they haven't been trying all along.
  - smallnamespace 6y ago
    > They don't necessarily have control over their disorder, and are unable to change themselves alone. As someone who has dealt with serious, chronic health issues for a decade, I truly hate this attitude. I don't necessarily have full control over my health issues, but I'll be damned if you tell me I am unable to take actions to change myself and my situation. Yes, I much prefer messages that emphasize my personal agency, which your well-intentioned message actively denies. This is a tight-rope to walk: sick people have limitations and one should acknowledge them, but repeatedly asserting their utter helplessness is also a form of shaming and encourages them to stop trying.
    - TheOtherHobbes 6y ago
      No one is encouraging sick people to stop trying. They're trying to explain to relatively healthy and privileged people that blaming sick people for trying and failing is extremely unlikely to help them.
    - boomboomsubban 6y ago
      >As someone who has dealt with serious, chronic health issues for a decade, I truly hate this attitude Do your chronic health issues alter the way your mind operates? If you believe that some external agent is inserting thoughts into your mind, how do you take control of such a situation? That's an extreme example, but such issues are common with mental disorders. When your mind itself is ill, willpower alone doesn't necessarily cut it.
      - smallnamespace 6y ago
        My health issues came along with significant cognitive effects, ones that significantly affected my career. I can't speak towards schizophrenia specifically, but you work through mental health like any other obstacle: if it turns out to be an impassable mountain, then go around it. This is what I hear in GGP's message, and it strongly resonates with my own experience.
        6y ago
- mmmmmk 6y ago
  Yeah, I hear and sympathize with you, but it's a bit of a truism and misses the point. If this was about lead poisoning, and not parental income, that leads to mental illness, wouldn't you want to fix the problem, rather than just say buck up?
- ABCLAW 6y ago
  >I don't understand why people think I'm against helping people. For the purpose of trying to fill in that knowledge gap, let me say that as someone that just casually browsed the comments, you originally came across as tone-deaf and disconnected from reality. After the comment attempting to dismiss mental disorders, you came across as actively malicious. If you're serious about just trying to help people, try harder than telling them to work harder on a forum almost exclusively populated with well-off professionals.
- falcolas 6y ago
  > I'm not trying to shame anyone. Yes, you are. “Most mental disorders are not that serious” is passive-aggressively stating that those suffering from something you consider to “not be serious” just aren’t working hard enough; that they’re lazy, not disabled. The truth is, you can work as hard as you want, but if you’re not lucky as well, that work won’t propel you forward. https://youtu.be/3LopI4YeC4I https://youtu.be/3LopI4YeC4I <- Veritasium on luck vs hard work

eplanit 6y ago

So, hospital for bumps and bruises, because they're just as serious as broken bones?

boomboomsubban 6y ago
No, provide all the children with the safety equipment that limits both bruises and broken bones rather than only give it to the wealthy children.

davidn20 6y ago

I don't understand why people think I'm against helping people. I'm not. I'm not trying to shame anyone. I'm simply saying, no matter your situation, do the best you can because that's what you have control over. Also, it's easier to change yourself, than to change the world. I mean if you're fighting to change the world, more power to you. I hope you succeed and make the world a fairer place.

boomboomsubban 6y ago
>I'm simply saying, no matter your situation, do the best you can because that's what you have control over. Also, it's easier to change yourself, than to change the world Again, you're telling this to people with mental disorders like schizophrenia. They don't necessarily have control over their disorder, and are unable to change themselves alone. This is why it seems like you're shaming people. You both belittled their issues and are telling them to just get over them, like they haven't been trying all along.
- smallnamespace 6y ago
  > They don't necessarily have control over their disorder, and are unable to change themselves alone. As someone who has dealt with serious, chronic health issues for a decade, I truly hate this attitude. I don't necessarily have full control over my health issues, but I'll be damned if you tell me I am unable to take actions to change myself and my situation. Yes, I much prefer messages that emphasize my personal agency, which your well-intentioned message actively denies. This is a tight-rope to walk: sick people have limitations and one should acknowledge them, but repeatedly asserting their utter helplessness is also a form of shaming and encourages them to stop trying.
  - TheOtherHobbes 6y ago
    No one is encouraging sick people to stop trying. They're trying to explain to relatively healthy and privileged people that blaming sick people for trying and failing is extremely unlikely to help them.
  - boomboomsubban 6y ago
    >As someone who has dealt with serious, chronic health issues for a decade, I truly hate this attitude Do your chronic health issues alter the way your mind operates? If you believe that some external agent is inserting thoughts into your mind, how do you take control of such a situation? That's an extreme example, but such issues are common with mental disorders. When your mind itself is ill, willpower alone doesn't necessarily cut it.
    - smallnamespace 6y ago
      My health issues came along with significant cognitive effects, ones that significantly affected my career. I can't speak towards schizophrenia specifically, but you work through mental health like any other obstacle: if it turns out to be an impassable mountain, then go around it. This is what I hear in GGP's message, and it strongly resonates with my own experience.
      - 6y ago
mmmmmk 6y ago
Yeah, I hear and sympathize with you, but it's a bit of a truism and misses the point. If this was about lead poisoning, and not parental income, that leads to mental illness, wouldn't you want to fix the problem, rather than just say buck up?
ABCLAW 6y ago
>I don't understand why people think I'm against helping people. For the purpose of trying to fill in that knowledge gap, let me say that as someone that just casually browsed the comments, you originally came across as tone-deaf and disconnected from reality. After the comment attempting to dismiss mental disorders, you came across as actively malicious. If you're serious about just trying to help people, try harder than telling them to work harder on a forum almost exclusively populated with well-off professionals.
falcolas 6y ago
> I'm not trying to shame anyone. Yes, you are. “Most mental disorders are not that serious” is passive-aggressively stating that those suffering from something you consider to “not be serious” just aren’t working hard enough; that they’re lazy, not disabled. The truth is, you can work as hard as you want, but if you’re not lucky as well, that work won’t propel you forward. https://youtu.be/3LopI4YeC4I https://youtu.be/3LopI4YeC4I <- Veritasium on luck vs hard work