4 ms·
Couple of thoughts: - The other factor to consider here is the use of insulation to protect against moisture in the structure, which will deteriorate materials
by saeranv 6y ago
Couple of thoughts:
- The other factor to consider here is the use of insulation to protect against moisture in the structure, which will deteriorate materials and decrease the thermal resistance of the structure. Looks like the comment section gets into this.
- I think it's mistake to not insulate the floor. Rule of thumb is soil underneath building is 2C less then average indoor space temperature[1] - for commercial buildings, probably more residential since there's less equipment. So there will be heat loss. More importantly, the ground consists of wet soil with moisture that wants to evaporate up into the structure. Insulation is one of the crucial components of preventing this (in addition to proper site drainage, and air/vapor barriers).
- I think this kind of steady-state calculation is great for a quick back-of-envelope calculation like this. But, for the sake of completeness, I want to mention that heating is a dynamic process with multiple modes of transfer, and not modeling it that way means we're neglecting the following impacts: air infiltration/ventilation that changes with pressure differences, solar radiation, heat generated from people and office equipment, latent energy impact of humid air, and the changing resistance associated with air films on surfaces. Thermal mass is also one, but is already mentioned in the original post.
[1] https://bigladdersoftware.com/epx/docs/8-3/auxiliary-programs/energyplus-weather-file-epw-data-dictionary.html https://bigladdersoftware.com/epx/docs/8-3/auxiliary-program...
ETA: Now that I've thought about it some more, I think there is one possible source of error here that can really throw off even back-of-envelope calculations like this: accurately calculating the thermal resistance of the windows.
Specifically, one underlying assumption in this calculation is that the R-value for each material is uniform, even though in reality a wall (for example) consists of different materials with different heat transfer rates (i.e think of heat through a cross-section of the wall cut through a stud versus a non-stud area). The manufacturer=provided R-value for assemblies will incorporate the thermal bridging of studs, and fasteners, but won't account for the impact of thermal bridging at wall/roof/floor intersections and at windows. The thermal bridging impact is going to be negligible for wall intersections for a simple rectangular prism-type building, but the impact of window thermal bridging should really change the window thermal resistance.
Which in turn may really change the ROI impact of insulation calculated here, since windows are basically open holes in your thermal envelope, and even a slight reduction in its performance can reduce the efficiency impact of wall insulation. In my experience it's more common to go for higher-performance windows (double/triple-pane) before going for wall insulation increases in energy retrofits.
Assuming this isn't already incorporated, it can be approximated by looking it up in the window manufacturer specifications. They usually provide edge-of-window and center-of-window U-values (reciprocal of R-value, more appropriate for heat transfer in parallel constructions) that can be used to calculate a new area-weighted R-value for the window (i.e assume 2 inches offset from window frame for edge-of-window U-value).
I would also look up window air film coefficients, since there's a stagnant film of air on surfaces that can add about about 1/3 increased resistance to double-pane windows. R-values typically don't include film coefficients.
- frankus 6y agoThere definitely are some subtleties of building science involved. Insulation doesn’t so much keep your house warm (that’s what the furnace does) as keep the outside of your walls cold (at which point they radiate/convect less heat into the air). If the air reaches its dew point at an inopportune place in the wall assembly you can easily get moisture damage and/or mold.
- jaclaz 6y agoYes, if you want a good insulation you need a mechanical ventilation (with air heat exchanger) otherwise - besides mold - you will be living in a non-healty environment. Even on non particuarly insulated houses our grandmothers and mothers did - at least once a day - change the air, opening windows for some fifteen minutes, there were reasons for that, and they remain valid. Nowadays that tradition is largely lost (for whatever reason) and some way to change air needs to be provided (and it comes with a cost and complications attached). I have seen too many houses built in the early days of energy saving (that began here roughly 10-12 years ago) with serious mold or however humidity issues, and even nowadays, when the issue is (partially) re-known, I see freshly built houses in class B or C (in EU they are classified with the best being A+ and the worst being G) without any mechanical ventilation provisions (houses in classes A/1/2/3/4 now largely have them).
- saeranv 6y agoYeah, the building science/architecture had to go through a painful learning process about mold, and humidity (see the leaky condo crisis in British Columbia[1]). That being said, the consensus in building science circles is now converging to the idea of building airtight buildings (i.e Passive House) with layer air and vapour barriers, along with insulation to manage moisture and heat. That way you don't sacrifice heating to manage your moisture. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Leaky_condo_crisis https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Leaky_condo_crisis