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I don't think that's a fair assessment at all. Both Google and, especially, Apple have spent millions of dollars, hours, and effort to create their respective A

I don't think that's a fair assessment at all. Both Google and, especially, Apple have spent millions of dollars, hours, and effort to create their respective App Stores and the people and tools needed to run them. There's a reason why there's a difference, in the real world, between a Walmart and a Target or Sprouts. Likewise, there's a difference between Apple, Google, or anyone else's App Stores. The main difference being that Apple makes it easy and far less risky for customers to pay for what they're getting. Developers aren't buying into just the App Store, they're buying in to the whole group of customers that said App Store brings with them.

bergstromm466 6y ago
> Both Google and, especially, Apple have spent millions of dollars, hours, and effort to create their respective App Stores and the people and tools needed to run them. Google and Apple spent Millions 'claiming' Patents/IP, monopolizing new discoveries, and 'earning' Billions. "Place Silicon Valley in its proper historical context and you see that, despite its mythology, it’s far from unique. Rather, it fits into a pattern of rapid technological change which has shaped recent centuries. In this case, advances in information technology have unleashed a wave of new capabilities. Just as the internal combustion engine and the growth of the railroads created Rockefeller, and the telecommunications boom created AT&T, this breakthrough enabled a few well-placed corporations to reap the rewards. By capitalising on network effects, early mover advantage, and near-zero marginal costs of production, they have positioned themselves as gateways to information, giving them the power to extract rent from every transaction. Undergirding this state of affairs is a set of intellectual property rights explicitly designed to favour corporations. This system — the flip side of globalisation — is propagated by various trade agreements and global institutions at the behest of the nation states who benefit from it the most. It’s no accident that Silicon Valley is a uniquely American phenomenon; not only does it owe its success to the United States’ exceptionally high defence spending — the source of its research funding and foundational technological breakthroughs — that very military might is itself what implicitly secures the intellectual property regime." [1] [1] https://tribunemag.co.uk/2019/01/abolish-silicon-valley https://tribunemag.co.uk/2019/01/abolish-silicon-valley
neogodless 6y ago
> they're buying in to the whole group of customers that said App Store brings with them. Isn't that what a duopoly is, by definition?
- dpkonofa 6y ago
  No, because there are other alternatives. The App Stores in these cases aren't considered their own market segments because they rely on the purchase of device to access them. Those devices are available from a large number of providers. Don't like Apple? Get an Android phone from any number of providers. Don't like the service? Switch to another carrier. Until the law changes to a point where companies have to allow other people to dictate their platforms (which will never happen), a company can do whatever it wants so long as it doesn't prevent a competitor from spinning up their own version.
ROARosen 6y ago
> Both Google and, especially, Apple have spent millions of dollars, hours, and effort to create their respective App Stores and the people and tools needed to run them Both Google and especially Apple have also spent millions of resources and money, making sure they are the only app store in use (by default). They could have spent some of those millions creating a set of rules for independent app marketplaces to be able to distribute content on their platform instead of locking everyone in to theirs'.
- ntsplnkv2 6y ago
  > creating a set of rules for independent app marketplaces How is this any different?
  - ROARosen 6y ago
    This implies - of course - that they will allow other app marketplaces to begin with.
- enos_feedler 6y ago
  I love how we suddenly have better ideas for how the most successful public company should allocate their resources to serve their customers (developers are second tier, sorry). We sometimes forget they are sitting on mountains of money because they execute good company decision making, not because they are doing weird things to protect a monopoly. Like there is some meeting near the top between execs happening where someone goes "lets do X!" and another exec replies "no but doing X would harm our monopoly, we cant' do that". Do people think decisions are really being actively made to protect a monopoly?
  - ROARosen 6y ago
    With this rationale no monopoly should ever be investigated, broken up, etc. The whole problem with monopolies is that they actually harm the consumer by protecting their monopoly from encroachment by someone else. So yes people really think decisions are being made by a monopoly to protect their monopoly (and their profits). A chunk of those billions they have is actually money generated by these monopolistic practices. It's juvenile to imagine them sitting at board meeting and discussing "How can we protect our monopoly?", that's like saying the NSA is discussing by board meetings "how can we further invade everyones privacy?". But they most definitely are discussing how they can protect their market share and how to edge out competition.

bergstromm466 6y ago

> Both Google and, especially, Apple have spent millions of dollars, hours, and effort to create their respective App Stores and the people and tools needed to run them. Google and Apple spent Millions 'claiming' Patents/IP, monopolizing new discoveries, and 'earning' Billions. "Place Silicon Valley in its proper historical context and you see that, despite its mythology, it’s far from unique. Rather, it fits into a pattern of rapid technological change which has shaped recent centuries. In this case, advances in information technology have unleashed a wave of new capabilities. Just as the internal combustion engine and the growth of the railroads created Rockefeller, and the telecommunications boom created AT&T, this breakthrough enabled a few well-placed corporations to reap the rewards. By capitalising on network effects, early mover advantage, and near-zero marginal costs of production, they have positioned themselves as gateways to information, giving them the power to extract rent from every transaction. Undergirding this state of affairs is a set of intellectual property rights explicitly designed to favour corporations. This system — the flip side of globalisation — is propagated by various trade agreements and global institutions at the behest of the nation states who benefit from it the most. It’s no accident that Silicon Valley is a uniquely American phenomenon; not only does it owe its success to the United States’ exceptionally high defence spending — the source of its research funding and foundational technological breakthroughs — that very military might is itself what implicitly secures the intellectual property regime." [1] [1] https://tribunemag.co.uk/2019/01/abolish-silicon-valley https://tribunemag.co.uk/2019/01/abolish-silicon-valley

neogodless 6y ago

> they're buying in to the whole group of customers that said App Store brings with them. Isn't that what a duopoly is, by definition?

dpkonofa 6y ago
No, because there are other alternatives. The App Stores in these cases aren't considered their own market segments because they rely on the purchase of device to access them. Those devices are available from a large number of providers. Don't like Apple? Get an Android phone from any number of providers. Don't like the service? Switch to another carrier. Until the law changes to a point where companies have to allow other people to dictate their platforms (which will never happen), a company can do whatever it wants so long as it doesn't prevent a competitor from spinning up their own version.

ROARosen 6y ago

> Both Google and, especially, Apple have spent millions of dollars, hours, and effort to create their respective App Stores and the people and tools needed to run them Both Google and especially Apple have also spent millions of resources and money, making sure they are the only app store in use (by default). They could have spent some of those millions creating a set of rules for independent app marketplaces to be able to distribute content on their platform instead of locking everyone in to theirs'.

ntsplnkv2 6y ago
> creating a set of rules for independent app marketplaces How is this any different?
- ROARosen 6y ago
  This implies - of course - that they will allow other app marketplaces to begin with.
enos_feedler 6y ago
I love how we suddenly have better ideas for how the most successful public company should allocate their resources to serve their customers (developers are second tier, sorry). We sometimes forget they are sitting on mountains of money because they execute good company decision making, not because they are doing weird things to protect a monopoly. Like there is some meeting near the top between execs happening where someone goes "lets do X!" and another exec replies "no but doing X would harm our monopoly, we cant' do that". Do people think decisions are really being actively made to protect a monopoly?
- ROARosen 6y ago
  With this rationale no monopoly should ever be investigated, broken up, etc. The whole problem with monopolies is that they actually harm the consumer by protecting their monopoly from encroachment by someone else. So yes people really think decisions are being made by a monopoly to protect their monopoly (and their profits). A chunk of those billions they have is actually money generated by these monopolistic practices. It's juvenile to imagine them sitting at board meeting and discussing "How can we protect our monopoly?", that's like saying the NSA is discussing by board meetings "how can we further invade everyones privacy?". But they most definitely are discussing how they can protect their market share and how to edge out competition.