6 ms·

Interesting that they're still using the old 150W power supply when Anandtech measured the entire system's maximum power draw at 37W IIRC. It makes this first g

Interesting that they're still using the old 150W power supply when Anandtech measured the entire system's maximum power draw at 37W IIRC. It makes this first generation of ARM Macs feel kind of lazily cobbled together. It'll be interesting to see future designs where the M1 wasn't just retrofitted but is a first class citizen.

spijdar 6y ago
Purely speculating here, but Thunderbolt allows for pretty substantial power to be sent bidirectional. It's conceivable that the excess power could be used for that or some other peripheral. I know I can charge my MBP off the excess power from my Dell w/thunderbolt 3, with a similar power supply discrepeny (only ever measured 50-60W used in system, but power supply is rated for 110-120W IIRC) Or, they're just being lazy/economical and reusing old stock.
kevindong 6y ago
To play devil's advocate, why bother designing a new PSU when you can just slap in the existing one and be perfectly compatible? The efficiency differences with a 37 W max power draw is negligible.
- yborg 6y ago
  It's also a proven component with an established supply chain. A new PSU has to go through worldwide certification testing, etc. Why incur additional cost for a low-volume product?
wffurr 6y ago
For the Mac Mini, I'd rather see it grow the ability to use more power than get smaller. More RAM, more cores, more GPU, more ports, eGPU capability. It's already a fairly convenient size that you can buy server racks and brackets for. The new system design I want to see is an update on the 11" MacBook Air or the 12" MacBook. I'd like to see if they can get a clamshell with good battery life and decent performance under two pounds and just wide enough for a full-size keyboard. The 11" MacBook Air is still my favorite laptop I've ever owned; I'm sad they discontinued it and didn't refresh the design. Maybe it can come back with an M1 or M2 chip, though.
- bnt 6y ago
  I’d love them to just ship the MB 12” board inside a keyboard with 2 USB-C ports and have a modern day Commodore. It can be powered by the USB-C monitor.
- flo123456 6y ago
  Yes, please a new 11“ would be truly awesome.
- bredren 6y ago
  Yes, what I'd like to see is a new Apple Silicon eGPU. Based on the Blackmagic design, but smaller, fanless and graphics power to compete with nvidia. Why fuss over driver compatibility if the performance on Apple's graphics cards blows away the competition?
- kingnothing 6y ago
  The new Air only weights 2.8 lbs. I'm curious, what difference does a pound less really make when it's already so light?
  - wffurr 6y ago
    Another pound is a full third of that weight. That’s a big percentage. Anecdotally, there was a step function between 3 lb ultraportable laptops with 12-13” displays and the 2.2 lb 11” MacBook Air. It was the most grabbable, portable computer I’ve ever owned with enough CPU power to handle my Computer Science coursework. It changed my relationship with my laptop. It no longer felt like a lump in my bag that needed to be handled carefully, like all the previous plastic bodied things I’d owned. I have since used a 13” Air, Pixelbook, Samsung Galaxy Chromebook (until it died), and I’m typing this now on an iPad Pro, and I still miss that laptop. The HP Dragonfly looks real nice, maybe if I put Linux on it. It’s also $2200 for decent specs though, whereas the 11” MacBook Air was a comparatively reasonable $899.
fsflyer 6y ago
I'll speculate that the follow-on to the M1 Mac Mini will use a more powerful processor that has higher power requirements and supports more ports with higher power requirements. Is it cost effective to drop to a smaller power supply for one generation? Or just leave that supply chain in place?
Tsiklon 6y ago
Could it be that the 150W PSU is kept in order to power thunderbolt peripherals, or does thunderbolt not offer the ability to transmit power to peripherals from the host?
wil421 6y ago
What happens when I plug an iPad and 3 other TB devices into the Mac Mini? Is the power still 37w?
jmull 6y ago
"lazily" is probably the wrong word. For the first release, the approach here is pretty obviously: The minimum changes needed to existing machines to accommodate the M1. That approach makes a lot of sense because it minimizes the time to market. It puts Apple silicon in people's hands as soon as possible. That's important because the sooner that happens, the sooner the software will be updated for AS. Think about it: the alternative was to just make people wait for the redesigns, which will take a year or two more. And the redesigns are coming... judging by all that empty space in that mini, they will be dramatic.
- masklinn 6y ago
  > That approach makes a lot of sense because it minimizes the time to market. Apple most likely has the oomph (financial and human) to do both at once. However only changing one thing makes troubleshooting way easier if things go wrong. Here the case and overall machine design is a known entity.
rsynnott 6y ago
Honestly, from their point of view, they less they change in the first gen the better. Reduces the risk of exciting first gen Apple product problems marring the M1 launch. They did this with Intel, too, more or less. Also, historically the Mac Mini has been a split line; one SKU with a low power (~20W) chip and one with a 45W chip. But otherwise mostly the same. It's fairly plausible that they repeat that here; when the M1X or whatever shows up I'd expect to see a more expensive Mac Mini SKU that has one.

spijdar 6y ago

Purely speculating here, but Thunderbolt allows for pretty substantial power to be sent bidirectional. It's conceivable that the excess power could be used for that or some other peripheral. I know I can charge my MBP off the excess power from my Dell w/thunderbolt 3, with a similar power supply discrepeny (only ever measured 50-60W used in system, but power supply is rated for 110-120W IIRC) Or, they're just being lazy/economical and reusing old stock.

kevindong 6y ago

To play devil's advocate, why bother designing a new PSU when you can just slap in the existing one and be perfectly compatible? The efficiency differences with a 37 W max power draw is negligible.

yborg 6y ago
It's also a proven component with an established supply chain. A new PSU has to go through worldwide certification testing, etc. Why incur additional cost for a low-volume product?

wffurr 6y ago

For the Mac Mini, I'd rather see it grow the ability to use more power than get smaller. More RAM, more cores, more GPU, more ports, eGPU capability. It's already a fairly convenient size that you can buy server racks and brackets for. The new system design I want to see is an update on the 11" MacBook Air or the 12" MacBook. I'd like to see if they can get a clamshell with good battery life and decent performance under two pounds and just wide enough for a full-size keyboard. The 11" MacBook Air is still my favorite laptop I've ever owned; I'm sad they discontinued it and didn't refresh the design. Maybe it can come back with an M1 or M2 chip, though.

bnt 6y ago
I’d love them to just ship the MB 12” board inside a keyboard with 2 USB-C ports and have a modern day Commodore. It can be powered by the USB-C monitor.
flo123456 6y ago
Yes, please a new 11“ would be truly awesome.
bredren 6y ago
Yes, what I'd like to see is a new Apple Silicon eGPU. Based on the Blackmagic design, but smaller, fanless and graphics power to compete with nvidia. Why fuss over driver compatibility if the performance on Apple's graphics cards blows away the competition?
kingnothing 6y ago
The new Air only weights 2.8 lbs. I'm curious, what difference does a pound less really make when it's already so light?
- wffurr 6y ago
  Another pound is a full third of that weight. That’s a big percentage. Anecdotally, there was a step function between 3 lb ultraportable laptops with 12-13” displays and the 2.2 lb 11” MacBook Air. It was the most grabbable, portable computer I’ve ever owned with enough CPU power to handle my Computer Science coursework. It changed my relationship with my laptop. It no longer felt like a lump in my bag that needed to be handled carefully, like all the previous plastic bodied things I’d owned. I have since used a 13” Air, Pixelbook, Samsung Galaxy Chromebook (until it died), and I’m typing this now on an iPad Pro, and I still miss that laptop. The HP Dragonfly looks real nice, maybe if I put Linux on it. It’s also $2200 for decent specs though, whereas the 11” MacBook Air was a comparatively reasonable $899.

fsflyer 6y ago

I'll speculate that the follow-on to the M1 Mac Mini will use a more powerful processor that has higher power requirements and supports more ports with higher power requirements. Is it cost effective to drop to a smaller power supply for one generation? Or just leave that supply chain in place?

Tsiklon 6y ago

Could it be that the 150W PSU is kept in order to power thunderbolt peripherals, or does thunderbolt not offer the ability to transmit power to peripherals from the host?

wil421 6y ago

What happens when I plug an iPad and 3 other TB devices into the Mac Mini? Is the power still 37w?

jmull 6y ago

"lazily" is probably the wrong word. For the first release, the approach here is pretty obviously: The minimum changes needed to existing machines to accommodate the M1. That approach makes a lot of sense because it minimizes the time to market. It puts Apple silicon in people's hands as soon as possible. That's important because the sooner that happens, the sooner the software will be updated for AS. Think about it: the alternative was to just make people wait for the redesigns, which will take a year or two more. And the redesigns are coming... judging by all that empty space in that mini, they will be dramatic.

masklinn 6y ago
> That approach makes a lot of sense because it minimizes the time to market. Apple most likely has the oomph (financial and human) to do both at once. However only changing one thing makes troubleshooting way easier if things go wrong. Here the case and overall machine design is a known entity.

rsynnott 6y ago

Honestly, from their point of view, they less they change in the first gen the better. Reduces the risk of exciting first gen Apple product problems marring the M1 launch. They did this with Intel, too, more or less. Also, historically the Mac Mini has been a split line; one SKU with a low power (~20W) chip and one with a 45W chip. But otherwise mostly the same. It's fairly plausible that they repeat that here; when the M1X or whatever shows up I'd expect to see a more expensive Mac Mini SKU that has one.