4 ms·

Election so secure and so beyond reproach, that the largest county in Michigan refused to certify the results today. s/ https://www.detroitnews.com/story/news/

by m0zg 6y ago

Election so secure and so beyond reproach, that the largest county in Michigan refused to certify the results today. s/ https://www.detroitnews.com/story/news/politics/2020/11/17/wayne-county-canvassers-deadlock-certifying-november-3-election-results/6324274002/ https://www.detroitnews.com/story/news/politics/2020/11/17/w...

nooron 6y ago
Hello, I have worked on campaigns in Detroit and throughout the state, so I have some clarity on the ways in which the city and the state’s elections can be fraught. If the supposed anomalies in voting patterns amounted to meaningful misconduct, the 2 GOP commissioners would not have certified Livonia, which experienced anomalies at a proportionately higher rate than Detroit. What you are sharing is evidence that the process has been increasingly captured by partisan interests, which is bad for everyone.
- m0zg 6y ago
  Be that as it may, even you concede these were "anomalies". So Krebs sounds like a partisan hack to me. Some places are still counting ballots. Some are finding misplaced ballots, or "glitches" which just happen to always benefit Biden, and so on. Dead people voted. This is all fishy AF.
  - nooron 6y ago
    There are small and infrequently consequential anomalies in every election, in every state. A physical corollary of this fact is that most recounts at the statewide level result in perhaps ~100 ballots changing. That's because voter fraud in the US is very uncommon and does not demonstrate reliable partisan lean, and neither do alleged "glitches". I cannot demonstrate from my keyboard that there are no cases of "dead people voted". It probably happens very infrequently. But I would note that in this election, at least some of these accusations have been proven inaccurate by diligent journalists. I lived through listening to liberals whine about Diebold in 2004 in Ohio and through their complaints that Cambridge Analytica somehow stole the election in 2016. Both of these complaints were powered by motivated reasoning, and ultimately unfounded. Yours is too. I would evidence my claims by noting that the board just certified Wayne County.
    - deleted 6y ago
      [deleted]
    - SV_BubbleTime 6y ago
      > I would evidence my claims by noting that the board just certified Wayne County. Is that the example you want to use? Because on that Zoom call, Ned Steabler and Abraham Amiyah’s threatened the two withholding members, called them racists, and read the names of their children’s schools. Shortly after one of them changed their vote. Yes, the two reversed their decision and certified with a request for an audit... but does that sound like good evidence for your point? Regardless of how anyone feels about election fraud, I’m pretty sure the people doxing children are not doing the right thing. https://streamable.com/yhl89p https://streamable.com/yhl89p and https://mobile.twitter.com/correctthemedia/status/1328969920357535744 https://mobile.twitter.com/correctthemedia/status/1328969920... Hooray for threatening women/children and mob rule?
      - nooron 6y ago
        If choosing to certify the more proportionately anomalous Livonia and not Detroit, disenfranchising hundreds of thousands of Black voters while accepting White voters, is not a form of racism, I don’t know what is. I don’t throw the word around lightly, but it is the right one in this context. I realize you’re unlikely to agree.
        SV_BubbleTime 6y ago
        Are you saying there’s no truth to the claim that they were more votes in Wayne County than registered voters? And that you don’t think an election board officer may find that suspicious? Did Lavonia County say they would stop counting at 10:30pm until the next morning but at 4am dump vote totals a higher rate than previously? Then continue on slowly for the rest of the week like Wayne county did? Were election observers kicked out of Lavonia County into a different room while election officers put wallpaper and window blockings up to prevent oversight like happened in Wayne? You were either uneducated about the facts of the matter in Wayne County, and want to explain anything you don’t like away with racism, or you were maliciously trying to gaslight people. https://mobile.twitter.com/MattFinnFNC/status/1324084637010976769 https://mobile.twitter.com/MattFinnFNC/status/13240846370109... > is not a form of racism, I don’t know what is. Yes, I agree with your latter claim. I think you’ve made your position pretty clear. threatening women and children because you disagree with an official officers opinion is OK.
belltaco 6y ago
They just certified it, the page that your link goes to has been updated.
- m0zg 6y ago
  From which we conclude that they are gullible idiots. They certified it on the condition that there will be an audit. There's not going to be audit if county has certified already. This does not change my point. With 70% of precincts showing unexplained anomalies, there are serious questions about fairness of this election. Here's why it was certified: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B6BFYOuCY_c https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B6BFYOuCY_c. Race card, fire and brimstone, you're going to hell, he threw at them everything he had without disputing any of the facts. They folded like cheap suits.
  - SV_BubbleTime 6y ago
    That video is everything that’s wrong with this hyper partisan nonsense. Those are direct threats to officials.
    - m0zg 6y ago
      You should check out his Twitter account. He's a real piece of work.
- m0zg 6y ago
  Actually, Trump just tweeted that they refused to sign the certification. This being Trump I don't know if it's true or not, but it is possible that they did not formally certify after all. In which case, kudos to them. Audit that thing first, then certify.

by m0zg 6y ago

nooron 6y ago

Hello, I have worked on campaigns in Detroit and throughout the state, so I have some clarity on the ways in which the city and the state’s elections can be fraught. If the supposed anomalies in voting patterns amounted to meaningful misconduct, the 2 GOP commissioners would not have certified Livonia, which experienced anomalies at a proportionately higher rate than Detroit. What you are sharing is evidence that the process has been increasingly captured by partisan interests, which is bad for everyone.

m0zg 6y ago
Be that as it may, even you concede these were "anomalies". So Krebs sounds like a partisan hack to me. Some places are still counting ballots. Some are finding misplaced ballots, or "glitches" which just happen to always benefit Biden, and so on. Dead people voted. This is all fishy AF.
- nooron 6y ago
  There are small and infrequently consequential anomalies in every election, in every state. A physical corollary of this fact is that most recounts at the statewide level result in perhaps ~100 ballots changing. That's because voter fraud in the US is very uncommon and does not demonstrate reliable partisan lean, and neither do alleged "glitches". I cannot demonstrate from my keyboard that there are no cases of "dead people voted". It probably happens very infrequently. But I would note that in this election, at least some of these accusations have been proven inaccurate by diligent journalists. I lived through listening to liberals whine about Diebold in 2004 in Ohio and through their complaints that Cambridge Analytica somehow stole the election in 2016. Both of these complaints were powered by motivated reasoning, and ultimately unfounded. Yours is too. I would evidence my claims by noting that the board just certified Wayne County.
  - deleted 6y ago
    [deleted]
  - SV_BubbleTime 6y ago
    > I would evidence my claims by noting that the board just certified Wayne County. Is that the example you want to use? Because on that Zoom call, Ned Steabler and Abraham Amiyah’s threatened the two withholding members, called them racists, and read the names of their children’s schools. Shortly after one of them changed their vote. Yes, the two reversed their decision and certified with a request for an audit... but does that sound like good evidence for your point? Regardless of how anyone feels about election fraud, I’m pretty sure the people doxing children are not doing the right thing. https://streamable.com/yhl89p https://streamable.com/yhl89p and https://mobile.twitter.com/correctthemedia/status/1328969920357535744 https://mobile.twitter.com/correctthemedia/status/1328969920... Hooray for threatening women/children and mob rule?
    - nooron 6y ago
      If choosing to certify the more proportionately anomalous Livonia and not Detroit, disenfranchising hundreds of thousands of Black voters while accepting White voters, is not a form of racism, I don’t know what is. I don’t throw the word around lightly, but it is the right one in this context. I realize you’re unlikely to agree.
      - SV_BubbleTime 6y ago
        Are you saying there’s no truth to the claim that they were more votes in Wayne County than registered voters? And that you don’t think an election board officer may find that suspicious? Did Lavonia County say they would stop counting at 10:30pm until the next morning but at 4am dump vote totals a higher rate than previously? Then continue on slowly for the rest of the week like Wayne county did? Were election observers kicked out of Lavonia County into a different room while election officers put wallpaper and window blockings up to prevent oversight like happened in Wayne? You were either uneducated about the facts of the matter in Wayne County, and want to explain anything you don’t like away with racism, or you were maliciously trying to gaslight people. https://mobile.twitter.com/MattFinnFNC/status/1324084637010976769 https://mobile.twitter.com/MattFinnFNC/status/13240846370109... > is not a form of racism, I don’t know what is. Yes, I agree with your latter claim. I think you’ve made your position pretty clear. threatening women and children because you disagree with an official officers opinion is OK.

belltaco 6y ago

They just certified it, the page that your link goes to has been updated.

m0zg 6y ago
From which we conclude that they are gullible idiots. They certified it on the condition that there will be an audit. There's not going to be audit if county has certified already. This does not change my point. With 70% of precincts showing unexplained anomalies, there are serious questions about fairness of this election. Here's why it was certified: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B6BFYOuCY_c https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B6BFYOuCY_c. Race card, fire and brimstone, you're going to hell, he threw at them everything he had without disputing any of the facts. They folded like cheap suits.
- SV_BubbleTime 6y ago
  That video is everything that’s wrong with this hyper partisan nonsense. Those are direct threats to officials.
  - m0zg 6y ago
    You should check out his Twitter account. He's a real piece of work.
m0zg 6y ago
Actually, Trump just tweeted that they refused to sign the certification. This being Trump I don't know if it's true or not, but it is possible that they did not formally certify after all. In which case, kudos to them. Audit that thing first, then certify.