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Yeah, disputed by a hard-right anti-mask COVID truther. I dunno about the story in question, but at this point, these people can't be considered neutral referee

Yeah, disputed by a hard-right anti-mask COVID truther. I dunno about the story in question, but at this point, these people can't be considered neutral referees. They exist to shitpost and drive wedges between people.

petertodd 6y ago
He provided an authoritative source - official death stats - and a rational explanation as to why that source suggests the nurses claim may be a lie. As others in this thread pointed out, the attention of getting on to CNN is unfortunately enough to encourage people to lie. You don't need to trust him personally.
- ceejayoz 6y ago
  > You don't need to trust him personally. You do, though. You need to trust that he's not omitting critical information, either via ignorance or deliberate malice. Information like this: https://www.cdc.gov/nchs/nvss/vsrr/covid19/tech_notes.htm https://www.cdc.gov/nchs/nvss/vsrr/covid19/tech_notes.htm > It is important to note that it can take several weeks for death records to be submitted to National Center for Health Statistics (NCHS), processed, coded, and tabulated. Therefore, the data shown on this page may be incomplete, and will likely not include all deaths that occurred during a given time period, especially for the more recent time periods.
  - petertodd 6y ago
    So the website the tweet used as it's source aggregates info directly from the relevant state governments, speeding up reporting compared to going through NCHS. How much, I'm not sure. This is the website they cite as their source for South Dakota: https://doh.sd.gov/news/Coronavirus.aspx https://doh.sd.gov/news/Coronavirus.aspx I don't seem to be able to access it - not sure if that's geoblocking (I'm in Canada) or it's down at the moment.
    - ceejayoz 6y ago
      That page indicates a lag in their data is similarly possible: > Deaths: SD-DOH does not report deaths until a certified death record has been filed with COVID-19 as a cause or contributing factor. By law, a death record must be filed within 5 days of the date of death. (I don't know how long it takes between filing and processing after that point, but it's clear that there's potential time between death and showing up in the count.)
      - petertodd 6y ago
        Oh, so it is in fact just geoblocked? That's annoying. It's still down for me (and my EU VPN). Does the site list deaths by date of report, or date of death? Hopefully the later, so we can just check back in a few weeks. Anyway, in general this "dying breath" stuff doesn't really tell anyone anything useful. For starters, how much faith do you really want to put in what people say when they're so sick they're about to die? Hypoxia significantly affects mental capacities: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kUfF2MTnqAw https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kUfF2MTnqAw For all you know, these people don't actually realize that they're sick at all.
dkdk8283 6y ago
Harsh words like this hammer the wedges, too. Let’s accept everyone (irrespective of them being right or wrong) and coexist in peace.
- jfengel 6y ago
  If you simply accept those who hammer wedges, they can be more successful at it. It's called the Paradox of Tolerance: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paradox_of_tolerance https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paradox_of_tolerance It's far from clear how to unravel the paradox, but it's certainly not as simple as "let's just all coexist in peace". It's asymmetric: it only takes one person to break the peace.
  - loopz 6y ago
    It takes people to prioritize truth, due dilligence, trust and maturity, not the extremely judgemental attitudes against anything not toing the partyline. The leader is simply the figurehead of the dysfunction, ie. the dysfunction itself meeting with the people face to face! Who doesn't allow two thoughts at the same time. Isn't that violation against free speech? Do opposite of that.

petertodd 6y ago

He provided an authoritative source - official death stats - and a rational explanation as to why that source suggests the nurses claim may be a lie. As others in this thread pointed out, the attention of getting on to CNN is unfortunately enough to encourage people to lie. You don't need to trust him personally.

ceejayoz 6y ago
> You don't need to trust him personally. You do, though. You need to trust that he's not omitting critical information, either via ignorance or deliberate malice. Information like this: https://www.cdc.gov/nchs/nvss/vsrr/covid19/tech_notes.htm https://www.cdc.gov/nchs/nvss/vsrr/covid19/tech_notes.htm > It is important to note that it can take several weeks for death records to be submitted to National Center for Health Statistics (NCHS), processed, coded, and tabulated. Therefore, the data shown on this page may be incomplete, and will likely not include all deaths that occurred during a given time period, especially for the more recent time periods.
- petertodd 6y ago
  So the website the tweet used as it's source aggregates info directly from the relevant state governments, speeding up reporting compared to going through NCHS. How much, I'm not sure. This is the website they cite as their source for South Dakota: https://doh.sd.gov/news/Coronavirus.aspx https://doh.sd.gov/news/Coronavirus.aspx I don't seem to be able to access it - not sure if that's geoblocking (I'm in Canada) or it's down at the moment.
  - ceejayoz 6y ago
    That page indicates a lag in their data is similarly possible: > Deaths: SD-DOH does not report deaths until a certified death record has been filed with COVID-19 as a cause or contributing factor. By law, a death record must be filed within 5 days of the date of death. (I don't know how long it takes between filing and processing after that point, but it's clear that there's potential time between death and showing up in the count.)
    - petertodd 6y ago
      Oh, so it is in fact just geoblocked? That's annoying. It's still down for me (and my EU VPN). Does the site list deaths by date of report, or date of death? Hopefully the later, so we can just check back in a few weeks. Anyway, in general this "dying breath" stuff doesn't really tell anyone anything useful. For starters, how much faith do you really want to put in what people say when they're so sick they're about to die? Hypoxia significantly affects mental capacities: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kUfF2MTnqAw https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kUfF2MTnqAw For all you know, these people don't actually realize that they're sick at all.

dkdk8283 6y ago

Harsh words like this hammer the wedges, too. Let’s accept everyone (irrespective of them being right or wrong) and coexist in peace.

jfengel 6y ago
If you simply accept those who hammer wedges, they can be more successful at it. It's called the Paradox of Tolerance: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paradox_of_tolerance https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paradox_of_tolerance It's far from clear how to unravel the paradox, but it's certainly not as simple as "let's just all coexist in peace". It's asymmetric: it only takes one person to break the peace.
- loopz 6y ago
  It takes people to prioritize truth, due dilligence, trust and maturity, not the extremely judgemental attitudes against anything not toing the partyline. The leader is simply the figurehead of the dysfunction, ie. the dysfunction itself meeting with the people face to face! Who doesn't allow two thoughts at the same time. Isn't that violation against free speech? Do opposite of that.