11 ms·

> for being, generally, useless While I understand what you’re going for here, this feels a bit eugenics-ish to me. They are as much a human being as you are a

by rafram 6y ago

> for being, generally, useless While I understand what you’re going for here, this feels a bit eugenics-ish to me. They are as much a human being as you are and people are capable of change. Odds are they didn’t choose to live there.

HarryHirsch 6y ago
The million-dollar question that it's all about is if the locals choose to be ignorant assholes or if they don't know better because of circumstances - multigenerational bad education and ready availability of Foxnews. You'd actually say that anyone who could moved away long ago, and it's only the dregs of society that are still there.
- jl2718 6y ago
  I think people living in hard situations develop all kinds of biases and tribalism out of necessity. Cosmopolitanism is a luxury good. If you can’t admit that you, with your own mind and morals, would act the same way in the same circumstances, that doesn’t seem any different than the bigotry you accuse ‘them’ of.
  - HarryHirsch 6y ago
    We have to disagree about the "necessity" of oppressing those who are not within your circle. Consider George Wallace, after whom streets are named in Alabama. As a young man he ran on a policy of good roads and schools, and when that didn't get him anywhere he changed strategy and had a long, successful career on a program of institutional racism. When you look at Alabama, giving the outgroup the helot treatment is either a way of life or a luxury good.
JumpCrisscross 6y ago
> They are as much a human being as you are and people are capable of change Totally agree. But these attitudes towards fellow people tend to pair with unproductive behaviours. Now, there are plenty of exceptions. Highly productive people with abhorrent views. But on average, acidic views tend to go with lower incomes at a population level. (I make no assertion on which way causation flows. And within a city, the relationship breaks down.)
- KittenInABox 6y ago
  > But on average, acidic views tend to go with lower incomes at a population level. (I make no assertion on which way causation flows. And within a city, the relationship breaks down.) This is classism and itself is abhorrent. As someone who lives in NYC, living in NYC and discussing abhorrent views in red states as correlated to income sounds utterly ridiculous on its face when we have our own corrupt NYPD (Stop and frisk, the kettling and brutality on peaceful protestors), ineffective mayor, and increased gentrification leading to homelessness. I'm absolutely baffled by "I treat living in NYC as a way to get away from lower income people and their abhorrent views" when NYC has lower income people that are actively being disenfranchised and the wealthy simply look the other way (which arguably is abhorrent!).
  - burnthrow 6y ago
    Note that parent is also one of the highest karma users on the site. What a community.

by rafram 6y ago

HarryHirsch 6y ago

The million-dollar question that it's all about is if the locals choose to be ignorant assholes or if they don't know better because of circumstances - multigenerational bad education and ready availability of Foxnews. You'd actually say that anyone who could moved away long ago, and it's only the dregs of society that are still there.

jl2718 6y ago
I think people living in hard situations develop all kinds of biases and tribalism out of necessity. Cosmopolitanism is a luxury good. If you can’t admit that you, with your own mind and morals, would act the same way in the same circumstances, that doesn’t seem any different than the bigotry you accuse ‘them’ of.
- HarryHirsch 6y ago
  We have to disagree about the "necessity" of oppressing those who are not within your circle. Consider George Wallace, after whom streets are named in Alabama. As a young man he ran on a policy of good roads and schools, and when that didn't get him anywhere he changed strategy and had a long, successful career on a program of institutional racism. When you look at Alabama, giving the outgroup the helot treatment is either a way of life or a luxury good.

JumpCrisscross 6y ago

> They are as much a human being as you are and people are capable of change Totally agree. But these attitudes towards fellow people tend to pair with unproductive behaviours. Now, there are plenty of exceptions. Highly productive people with abhorrent views. But on average, acidic views tend to go with lower incomes at a population level. (I make no assertion on which way causation flows. And within a city, the relationship breaks down.)

KittenInABox 6y ago
> But on average, acidic views tend to go with lower incomes at a population level. (I make no assertion on which way causation flows. And within a city, the relationship breaks down.) This is classism and itself is abhorrent. As someone who lives in NYC, living in NYC and discussing abhorrent views in red states as correlated to income sounds utterly ridiculous on its face when we have our own corrupt NYPD (Stop and frisk, the kettling and brutality on peaceful protestors), ineffective mayor, and increased gentrification leading to homelessness. I'm absolutely baffled by "I treat living in NYC as a way to get away from lower income people and their abhorrent views" when NYC has lower income people that are actively being disenfranchised and the wealthy simply look the other way (which arguably is abhorrent!).
- burnthrow 6y ago
  Note that parent is also one of the highest karma users on the site. What a community.