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Bigotry and hate speech should not have a platform. I’ve been reading a lot of comments here and it seems like most of them aren’t even critical or touch on the

Bigotry and hate speech should not have a platform. I’ve been reading a lot of comments here and it seems like most of them aren’t even critical or touch on the point of NOT allowing certain kind of speech or false information sharing. In Germany nazi related sympathizing, propaganda is banned from social media. But some how it’s ok in USA? I honestly fail to understand how little criticism there is of unfettered free speech, as if it’s universally a good thing. Same with guns, given overwhelming evidence to the contrary yet still USA sticks to these strange “rights”.

thinkingemote 6y ago
> I honestly fail to understand Do you think its possible for you to understand? Would you want to understand and learn new things? If you knew that honestly understanding would lead to mental pain and anguish as you literally would have to admit you were wrong in your past judgements and admit your view of the world was wrong, would you still want to understand? Because it will cause you pain. It even might lose you friends. Changing your mind is hard. Learning new things about the way the world works means you have to remove whatever was in that place before and you do that by admitting you were wrong. If you've been on HN for a while you will agree with me that having people admit they were wrong is extremely rare! It hurts. Most people don't want to understand. It's much easier not to. I applaud a sincere expression of not understanding, so congratulations! It means that somehow you know that your view of the world is not complete. I would suggest that instead of asking for answers from others which you can disagree with, true understanding requires a fundamental and painful change in your own brain. Empathy is just one tool to help understand and work out how you were wrong, there are others. It won't mean you start to believe the ideas just that for the first time you will start to see that there are other ideas. There is potential danger, however, that what caused your initial attachment to a particular view of the world might switch to these other newer ones. Like how an ex-cult member is always the most vocal anti cult activist, or how a recent Vegan is always the most evangelistic about their new way of life. Empathy alone doesn't cause that, but maybe a kind of stockholm syndrome, so take it slow and try not to be overwhelmed. Even if you feel like you could start to understand, there is also the fear and disgust of the other which you would need to overcome to begin. For many this fear and disgust is so strong it's enough to stop any thoughts of change. (it's why fear and disgust is so often used as a political tool) I'm not asking you to change and I don't expect you to change. Change hurts. I'm warning you about the dangers of understanding others if you really wanted to understand what's going on which I hope you might.
- atomi 6y ago
  We had wars over this. Bigotry lost. Don't destroy the world over a failed ideology.
  - thinkingemote 6y ago
    Bigotry is the failure to understand the other. It's literally in the definition! To understand the other is to win against bigotry. Don't destroy the world with bigotry disguised as righteousness. Most peace processes start with the humanising of the other and the identification of shared commonalities. Bigotry is against peace and coexistence. To advocate for not understanding people is to destroy the world. I get why people don't want to understand others (see above comment) but I would not encourage it.
    - atomi 6y ago
      I understand you wish things to be one way. In my opinion, bigotry in mainstream public discourse is never going to happen. It's a feature of capitalism and why you won't see gas vans as long as we remain a capitalist society. But don't let me dissuade you from advocating for your beliefs.
      - thinkingemote 6y ago
        It's ironic that most people will complain about polarization in politics at the same time as strengthening that very polarization. I would like less polarisation. Do you? Is wanting less polarisation and more understanding wanting the world one way? Seems like it might be the opposite. Seems also that those who are polarised want the world one way in opposition to the other group who wants the world the other. Is there a way to undo that? Would that way be painful? I think most people don't like to change their minds. It's painful. But just because it's painful, doesn't mean it's not possible or that it might be positive. How do we achieve polarization? How is actual peace is the real world achieved? Wanting things to be one way is bigotry. I wish things to be understood more and less bigotry! What are my beliefs? How have I advocated for them? I see only an appeal for common ground, understanding and therefore less bigotry overall.

thinkingemote 6y ago

> I honestly fail to understand Do you think its possible for you to understand? Would you want to understand and learn new things? If you knew that honestly understanding would lead to mental pain and anguish as you literally would have to admit you were wrong in your past judgements and admit your view of the world was wrong, would you still want to understand? Because it will cause you pain. It even might lose you friends. Changing your mind is hard. Learning new things about the way the world works means you have to remove whatever was in that place before and you do that by admitting you were wrong. If you've been on HN for a while you will agree with me that having people admit they were wrong is extremely rare! It hurts. Most people don't want to understand. It's much easier not to. I applaud a sincere expression of not understanding, so congratulations! It means that somehow you know that your view of the world is not complete. I would suggest that instead of asking for answers from others which you can disagree with, true understanding requires a fundamental and painful change in your own brain. Empathy is just one tool to help understand and work out how you were wrong, there are others. It won't mean you start to believe the ideas just that for the first time you will start to see that there are other ideas. There is potential danger, however, that what caused your initial attachment to a particular view of the world might switch to these other newer ones. Like how an ex-cult member is always the most vocal anti cult activist, or how a recent Vegan is always the most evangelistic about their new way of life. Empathy alone doesn't cause that, but maybe a kind of stockholm syndrome, so take it slow and try not to be overwhelmed. Even if you feel like you could start to understand, there is also the fear and disgust of the other which you would need to overcome to begin. For many this fear and disgust is so strong it's enough to stop any thoughts of change. (it's why fear and disgust is so often used as a political tool) I'm not asking you to change and I don't expect you to change. Change hurts. I'm warning you about the dangers of understanding others if you really wanted to understand what's going on which I hope you might.

atomi 6y ago
We had wars over this. Bigotry lost. Don't destroy the world over a failed ideology.
- thinkingemote 6y ago
  Bigotry is the failure to understand the other. It's literally in the definition! To understand the other is to win against bigotry. Don't destroy the world with bigotry disguised as righteousness. Most peace processes start with the humanising of the other and the identification of shared commonalities. Bigotry is against peace and coexistence. To advocate for not understanding people is to destroy the world. I get why people don't want to understand others (see above comment) but I would not encourage it.
  - atomi 6y ago
    I understand you wish things to be one way. In my opinion, bigotry in mainstream public discourse is never going to happen. It's a feature of capitalism and why you won't see gas vans as long as we remain a capitalist society. But don't let me dissuade you from advocating for your beliefs.
    - thinkingemote 6y ago
      It's ironic that most people will complain about polarization in politics at the same time as strengthening that very polarization. I would like less polarisation. Do you? Is wanting less polarisation and more understanding wanting the world one way? Seems like it might be the opposite. Seems also that those who are polarised want the world one way in opposition to the other group who wants the world the other. Is there a way to undo that? Would that way be painful? I think most people don't like to change their minds. It's painful. But just because it's painful, doesn't mean it's not possible or that it might be positive. How do we achieve polarization? How is actual peace is the real world achieved? Wanting things to be one way is bigotry. I wish things to be understood more and less bigotry! What are my beliefs? How have I advocated for them? I see only an appeal for common ground, understanding and therefore less bigotry overall.