4 ms·

It's just as presumptuous that every mentally ill person is carrying a firearm and is violent.

by bluntfang 6y ago

dageshi 6y ago
It only takes one to kill you? I think that's op's point.
- spoondan 6y ago
  But it isn’t a good point absent the bad assumption that the mentally ill are more dangerous. It only takes one bicyclist that’s fallen off his bike to kill you. So what?
  - dageshi 6y ago
    It isn't just the aspect of someone being mentally ill, it's someone being mentally ill and that their behaviour caused the police to be contacted.
    - joshuamorton 6y ago
      This is a symptom of people being to primed to believe that mentally ill people are dangerous, not a legitimate cause for concern. Purple call the police on someone yelling. A mentally ill person yelling isn't a danger. They might be in crisis or pain, or they might be unable to effectively communicate. A gun didn't help in any of those, the vast, vast majority of cases.
    - bluntfang 6y ago
      like that one time a white woman called the cops on a black man in central park? I don't think doing an action to have the policed called on you is the best approach, considering it can be weaponized by dishonest actors.
bigbubba 6y ago
Nobody in this discussion has presumed such a thing.
- ruined 6y ago
  It's the explicit expressed fear in the root comment, and the basis of the police warrior ideology.
  - bigbubba 6y ago
    The root commenter has said explicitly of armed violent people: "the vast majority of patients are not like that" So to reiterate, nobody in this thread has presumed as bluntfang claims.
    - joshuamorton 6y ago
      Yet their claim is that we need to respond as though every mentally ill person is an imminent threat.
      - bigbubba 6y ago
        Their claim, as I've interpreted it, is that their lived experiences have lead them to believe any situation must be treated with caution because they never know what to expect. That is simply not the same as presuming that every mentally ill person is carrying a firearm and is violent. As I see it, that's just common sense. If you get a call from a woman telling you she's fallen down and is hurt, how likely is it that EMTs are met at the door by a drunk man who claims nothing is wrong? What first appeared to be a simple medical situation may actually be a case of domestic violence. Neither the dispatcher nor the EMT can know this before anybody arrives on the scene, so whoever gets there first needs to be cognizant of all possibilities. Recognizing the possibility that somebody might be violent is not the same as believing they will be.
        joshuamorton 6y ago

It's just as presumptuous that every mentally ill person is carrying a firearm and is violent.

dageshi 6y ago

It only takes one to kill you? I think that's op's point.

spoondan 6y ago
But it isn’t a good point absent the bad assumption that the mentally ill are more dangerous. It only takes one bicyclist that’s fallen off his bike to kill you. So what?
- dageshi 6y ago
  It isn't just the aspect of someone being mentally ill, it's someone being mentally ill and that their behaviour caused the police to be contacted.
  - joshuamorton 6y ago
    This is a symptom of people being to primed to believe that mentally ill people are dangerous, not a legitimate cause for concern. Purple call the police on someone yelling. A mentally ill person yelling isn't a danger. They might be in crisis or pain, or they might be unable to effectively communicate. A gun didn't help in any of those, the vast, vast majority of cases.
  - bluntfang 6y ago
    like that one time a white woman called the cops on a black man in central park? I don't think doing an action to have the policed called on you is the best approach, considering it can be weaponized by dishonest actors.

bigbubba 6y ago

Nobody in this discussion has presumed such a thing.

ruined 6y ago
It's the explicit expressed fear in the root comment, and the basis of the police warrior ideology.
- bigbubba 6y ago
  The root commenter has said explicitly of armed violent people: "the vast majority of patients are not like that" So to reiterate, nobody in this thread has presumed as bluntfang claims.
  - joshuamorton 6y ago
    Yet their claim is that we need to respond as though every mentally ill person is an imminent threat.
    - bigbubba 6y ago
      Their claim, as I've interpreted it, is that their lived experiences have lead them to believe any situation must be treated with caution because they never know what to expect. That is simply not the same as presuming that every mentally ill person is carrying a firearm and is violent. As I see it, that's just common sense. If you get a call from a woman telling you she's fallen down and is hurt, how likely is it that EMTs are met at the door by a drunk man who claims nothing is wrong? What first appeared to be a simple medical situation may actually be a case of domestic violence. Neither the dispatcher nor the EMT can know this before anybody arrives on the scene, so whoever gets there first needs to be cognizant of all possibilities. Recognizing the possibility that somebody might be violent is not the same as believing they will be.
      - joshuamorton 6y ago