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"Being able to feel empathy and to take in the other person's perspective – these are two abilities through which we understand what is going on in the other pe

by a4444f 6y ago

"Being able to feel empathy and to take in the other person's perspective – these are two abilities through which we understand what is going on in the other person's mind." How about being able to feel oneself and take one's own perspective, for a change. What a strange world, where every one takes someone else's perspective.

snazz 6y ago
Humans are pretty good at taking our own perspectives. If everyone did that instead of empathizing with others, our conversations would all run in circles and we would be an even more polarized society.
- a4444f 6y ago
  I'd say, we converse with others, so that we could be more polarized / differentiated with respect to others. Only then we can have our own perspectives. Until that, we run in circles.
- bawolff 6y ago
  I actually don't think this is true. I've met lots of people who are self-deluding or don't conciously recognize their own patterns. We all have a story we tell about ourselves, but it often isn't the true story. That said, i don't think any of that conflicts with learning to empathisize with others. Understanding yourself is just as important as understanding other people. Personally i suspect they are related skills.
  - snazz 6y ago
    Hmm. That’s a valid point. I wasn’t thinking from that perspective, but your thoughts make sense. I came at it from the angle of arguing your own side in a disagreement with someone—that’s what I associate with perspective-taking. But the idea of misleading yourself with a fake story is another facet I failed to consider.
iron0013 6y ago
Always count on HN to provide plenty of arguments against empathy
- a4444f 6y ago
  "Empathy - the ability to share someone else's feelings or experiences by imagining what it would be like to be in that person's situation" I'd risk a statement, that it is actually impossible to take someone's else position. What one can do is precisely this - imagining someone's else position, which is a fiction (fueled by so called good intentions).
  - crispyambulance 6y ago
    > imagining someone's else position, which is a fiction Some people are better at this than others, and yes there's some guessing involved, but it doesn't have to be perfect to work. This is especially effective if the other recognizes the effort and also tries to empathize.

by a4444f 6y ago

snazz 6y ago

Humans are pretty good at taking our own perspectives. If everyone did that instead of empathizing with others, our conversations would all run in circles and we would be an even more polarized society.

a4444f 6y ago
I'd say, we converse with others, so that we could be more polarized / differentiated with respect to others. Only then we can have our own perspectives. Until that, we run in circles.
bawolff 6y ago
I actually don't think this is true. I've met lots of people who are self-deluding or don't conciously recognize their own patterns. We all have a story we tell about ourselves, but it often isn't the true story. That said, i don't think any of that conflicts with learning to empathisize with others. Understanding yourself is just as important as understanding other people. Personally i suspect they are related skills.
- snazz 6y ago
  Hmm. That’s a valid point. I wasn’t thinking from that perspective, but your thoughts make sense. I came at it from the angle of arguing your own side in a disagreement with someone—that’s what I associate with perspective-taking. But the idea of misleading yourself with a fake story is another facet I failed to consider.

iron0013 6y ago

Always count on HN to provide plenty of arguments against empathy

a4444f 6y ago
"Empathy - the ability to share someone else's feelings or experiences by imagining what it would be like to be in that person's situation" I'd risk a statement, that it is actually impossible to take someone's else position. What one can do is precisely this - imagining someone's else position, which is a fiction (fueled by so called good intentions).
- crispyambulance 6y ago
  > imagining someone's else position, which is a fiction Some people are better at this than others, and yes there's some guessing involved, but it doesn't have to be perfect to work. This is especially effective if the other recognizes the effort and also tries to empathize.