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But that's not battery technology, is it? If you wish to be the guy insisting "That's not batteries, that's battery packs!" nobody can stop you. Not really a

But that's not battery technology, is it? If you wish to be the guy insisting "That's not batteries, that's battery packs!" nobody can stop you. Not really a good look though.

ppf 6y ago
The chemistry and assembly of battery cells, and the system design of battery packs, are completely independent disciplines. I understand where the parent commenter is coming from - all the headlines make out that Tesla has some new battery (cell) tech. They don't - they just cleverly assemble Panasonic cells.
- nickik 6y ago
  They are not completely independent, the pack has to understand cell technology. That's like saying to develop a good cluster you have to understand nothing about individual servers. And Tesla actually has new cell technology and new pack technology that has nothing to do with Panasonic.
- CamperBob2 6y ago
  Absurd. Charge management has everything to do with thermal management and service life optimization, which in turn has everything to do with packaging and chemistry.
- ineedasername 6y ago
  You cannot reduce "battery technology" simply to the cell level. Because the cell isn't really battery tech in that pedantic sense either. If you're going to say the things that make batteries functional in their applications aren't part of the tech, then you're left with defining batteries merely as the chemical reactions that take place. It's like saying the glass housing isn't part of light bulb technology because it's not the element that actually gives off light. That the legs on a chair are not pair of chair technology because it's not the part you actually sit on. You cannot divorce the things that make something function in any practical sense for the concept of that area of technology. You seem to be taking issue with this topic because some articles imply it's the cell that's been innovated. You have a point: The articles should be clearer. But the failure of those articles to properly make that distinction doesn't mean it's not part of battery technology. Let's make this simpler: There is battery cell technology and there is battery management technology. Both are part of high tech implementations of battery systems.
- fencepost 6y ago
  You're absolutely correct, and it matters not one bit because for the general public (and even the not-so-general public of HN readers) they don't care that much about the difference and it really doesn't matter much if at all for the topic at hand.
numpad0 6y ago
You guys are terrible at hiding COI.
- WanderPanda 6y ago
  Whats COI?
  - lumberjack 6y ago
    conflict of interest, they are implying they are TSLA holders or shorters
    - numpad0 6y ago
      I’m implying employees. “Holders or shorters” is one of their template narratives
      - ineedasername 6y ago
        Just because those narratives may be used by the self-interested doesn't mean that are false in all cases. There are shorters, there are shills pushing the opposite way, but not every negative things said is a shorter, and not everything positive said is a shill.
        numpad0 6y ago
        You defended that narratives.
- fencepost 6y ago
  If I was a paid shill or investor for anyone selling batteries, battery packs, electric vehicles or anything related I'd have a lot more money in my bank account than I do. Probably wouldn't be driving a car that predates Tesla's IPO either.
- ineedasername 6y ago
  If you're not willing to have a conversation on the merits without resorting to accusing the other person of deliberate lies, you shouldn't be on HN. Right now you're basically saying that anyone who disagrees with your extremely narrow definition can't just be wrong, but also must be a self-interested shill for Tesla. Sure, there's probably TSLA holders or employees here that talk it up, but your inability to see anyone's comment that reflects well on Tesla as something other than self-interest instead of honest opinion is devolving your comments to the quality of conspiracy theories instead discussion.

But that's not battery technology, is it? If you wish to be the guy insisting "That's not batteries, that's battery packs!" nobody can stop you. Not really a good look though.

ppf 6y ago

The chemistry and assembly of battery cells, and the system design of battery packs, are completely independent disciplines. I understand where the parent commenter is coming from - all the headlines make out that Tesla has some new battery (cell) tech. They don't - they just cleverly assemble Panasonic cells.

nickik 6y ago
They are not completely independent, the pack has to understand cell technology. That's like saying to develop a good cluster you have to understand nothing about individual servers. And Tesla actually has new cell technology and new pack technology that has nothing to do with Panasonic.
CamperBob2 6y ago
Absurd. Charge management has everything to do with thermal management and service life optimization, which in turn has everything to do with packaging and chemistry.
ineedasername 6y ago
You cannot reduce "battery technology" simply to the cell level. Because the cell isn't really battery tech in that pedantic sense either. If you're going to say the things that make batteries functional in their applications aren't part of the tech, then you're left with defining batteries merely as the chemical reactions that take place. It's like saying the glass housing isn't part of light bulb technology because it's not the element that actually gives off light. That the legs on a chair are not pair of chair technology because it's not the part you actually sit on. You cannot divorce the things that make something function in any practical sense for the concept of that area of technology. You seem to be taking issue with this topic because some articles imply it's the cell that's been innovated. You have a point: The articles should be clearer. But the failure of those articles to properly make that distinction doesn't mean it's not part of battery technology. Let's make this simpler: There is battery cell technology and there is battery management technology. Both are part of high tech implementations of battery systems.
fencepost 6y ago
You're absolutely correct, and it matters not one bit because for the general public (and even the not-so-general public of HN readers) they don't care that much about the difference and it really doesn't matter much if at all for the topic at hand.

numpad0 6y ago

You guys are terrible at hiding COI.

WanderPanda 6y ago
Whats COI?
- lumberjack 6y ago
  conflict of interest, they are implying they are TSLA holders or shorters
  - numpad0 6y ago
    I’m implying employees. “Holders or shorters” is one of their template narratives
    - ineedasername 6y ago
      Just because those narratives may be used by the self-interested doesn't mean that are false in all cases. There are shorters, there are shills pushing the opposite way, but not every negative things said is a shorter, and not everything positive said is a shill.
      - numpad0 6y ago
        You defended that narratives.
fencepost 6y ago
If I was a paid shill or investor for anyone selling batteries, battery packs, electric vehicles or anything related I'd have a lot more money in my bank account than I do. Probably wouldn't be driving a car that predates Tesla's IPO either.
ineedasername 6y ago
If you're not willing to have a conversation on the merits without resorting to accusing the other person of deliberate lies, you shouldn't be on HN. Right now you're basically saying that anyone who disagrees with your extremely narrow definition can't just be wrong, but also must be a self-interested shill for Tesla. Sure, there's probably TSLA holders or employees here that talk it up, but your inability to see anyone's comment that reflects well on Tesla as something other than self-interest instead of honest opinion is devolving your comments to the quality of conspiracy theories instead discussion.