6 ms·

A large proportion, if not the majority of my doordash orders include some sort of promotion. They're everywhere and at this point I almost have an expectation

A large proportion, if not the majority of my doordash orders include some sort of promotion. They're everywhere and at this point I almost have an expectation that doordash will always have a promotion that lets me order at a discount. I think that these effective consumer subsidies are included in their "sales and marketing" budget.

cactus2093 6y ago
ah, ok that might be true. I was thinking most promotions go to first-time users but maybe that's not the case.
pbreit 6y ago
Pretty much every item I buy at Safeway is "discounted". Promos and discounts are a core component of many (not all!) businesses.
- ghaff 6y ago
  Safeway is sort of extreme. Many grocery chains do have some sort of loyalty card discount. But Safeway has huge discounts all over the place to the point where I make a point of slipping a loyalty card in my travel folder when I go somewhre that Safeways are common.
  - Lammy 6y ago
    > slipping a loyalty card in my travel folder Serious suggestion: try (your area code)-867-5309 and it will probably work.
    - kylebenzle 6y ago
      people are so strangely pliant about these loyalty programs.
      - ghaff 6y ago
        Safeway discounts on many items can be 25-50% off. Normally I don't but some stores make it quite expensive not to use them.
        Lammy 6y ago
        That’s why I like to use the meme card number to at least mix my data with as many other people as possible.
        not2b 6y ago
        If you don't use a card at Safeway you are way overpaying. It isn't a "discount", the list price isn't competitive. But the phone number I give them is one that I had 20 years ago, so it's of limited use to them.
        creato 6y ago
        I actually think Safeway is getting exactly what they want from you. They don't care to know who you are, they just want to know the frequency and correlation between the items you buy. That's not to say it's a bad thing that they are getting what they want. Not all data collection is an evil surveillance problem. Data can be useful for society too.
        prewett 6y ago
        I refuse to shop at Safeway if I have any other choice. The Safeways I've seen display their discount as $1.00 off their (excessive) price, and then expect me to believe that I'm getting a discount instead of getting the real price that they artificially raised by $1? Feels pretty insulting and manipulative.
    - nteon 6y ago
      (444) 444-4444 also works
      - drewblaisdell 6y ago
        10-4
    - strbean 6y ago
      (000) 000-0000 also worked last time I checked. It frequently has gas rewards as well.
  - nick0garvey 6y ago
    You can just use 555-555-5555 at Safeway and it works, I've never owned a card.
nipponese 6y ago
That's a valid and interesting point, but they are also swallowing the competition. If you believe their chart on page 3, uber actually lost marketshare over the last 22 months while DD grew 33%. I imagine at some point the industry matures and S&M budget subsides.
- roenxi 6y ago
  The core business model is they pick the food up in one place and put it down in a different place. "Market share" is not meaningful, there is about as low a barrier to entry for competition as it is possible to get. It isn't an achievement to gain 100% market share if each transaction makes a loss. If they try to raise prices to neutral or profitable levels it is likely that the market will shrink and competitors will charge in. It may be that the equilibrium market is restaurants and food outlets do their own delivery for free or at cost. Then there isn't much of a market for a service like DoorDash to make a profit in. It is possible that there is a market there and DoorDash will one day, somehow, make more money than they spend. But having a high market share is not much compensation when it requires constant losses to maintain.
  - paloaltoasshole 6y ago
    Market share is absolutely meaningful here. You are assuming that Doordash is losing money on each delivery. They do not in most markets.
three_seagrass 6y ago
They're excluded from revenue - i.e. $40 order that is $5 discounted is $35 revenue.
- MarkyC4 6y ago
  Disclaimer: I haven't read the article. My understanding is sometimes companies fudge the numbers though. If a $40 order has a $5 discount, they might consider $40 as revenue and put the $5 discount under a marketing expense
  - remote_phone 6y ago
    This is absolutely incorrect. You cannot take a discount as marketing expense and claim the full revenue. That is basic accounting that is not up for interpretation. If done intentionally it’s fraudulent.
    - belval 6y ago
      This comment was downvoted, which seems to imply that it's false. Is it? I know nothing about the laws of accounting and I am curious if you can truly offload discounts into marketing expenses.
      - arcticbull 6y ago
        So there's two kinds of accounting, GAAP and non-GAAP. A great example of non-GAAP accounting was WeWork's "community-adjusted EBITDA." When you use non-GAAP metrics to measure your business, you get to kind of define the standard by which you're measuring yourself. You get to do things exactly like the parent suggested, where you count 100% of the income as revenue and all your incentive spending as "marketing expenses." Uber does this too, for instance (back when it was a thing) 100% of the sticker price of an Uber Pool ride was reported as revenue while only the 30% cut of an UberX or Uber Black was reported as revenue, and yes, they would list driver incentives as marketing expenses.
        6y ago

cactus2093 6y ago

ah, ok that might be true. I was thinking most promotions go to first-time users but maybe that's not the case.

pbreit 6y ago

Pretty much every item I buy at Safeway is "discounted". Promos and discounts are a core component of many (not all!) businesses.

ghaff 6y ago
Safeway is sort of extreme. Many grocery chains do have some sort of loyalty card discount. But Safeway has huge discounts all over the place to the point where I make a point of slipping a loyalty card in my travel folder when I go somewhre that Safeways are common.
- Lammy 6y ago
  > slipping a loyalty card in my travel folder Serious suggestion: try (your area code)-867-5309 and it will probably work.
  - kylebenzle 6y ago
    people are so strangely pliant about these loyalty programs.
    - ghaff 6y ago
      Safeway discounts on many items can be 25-50% off. Normally I don't but some stores make it quite expensive not to use them.
      - Lammy 6y ago
        That’s why I like to use the meme card number to at least mix my data with as many other people as possible.
        not2b 6y ago
        If you don't use a card at Safeway you are way overpaying. It isn't a "discount", the list price isn't competitive. But the phone number I give them is one that I had 20 years ago, so it's of limited use to them.
        creato 6y ago
        I actually think Safeway is getting exactly what they want from you. They don't care to know who you are, they just want to know the frequency and correlation between the items you buy. That's not to say it's a bad thing that they are getting what they want. Not all data collection is an evil surveillance problem. Data can be useful for society too.
      - prewett 6y ago
        I refuse to shop at Safeway if I have any other choice. The Safeways I've seen display their discount as $1.00 off their (excessive) price, and then expect me to believe that I'm getting a discount instead of getting the real price that they artificially raised by $1? Feels pretty insulting and manipulative.
  - nteon 6y ago
    (444) 444-4444 also works
    - drewblaisdell 6y ago
      10-4
  - strbean 6y ago
    (000) 000-0000 also worked last time I checked. It frequently has gas rewards as well.
- nick0garvey 6y ago
  You can just use 555-555-5555 at Safeway and it works, I've never owned a card.

nipponese 6y ago

That's a valid and interesting point, but they are also swallowing the competition. If you believe their chart on page 3, uber actually lost marketshare over the last 22 months while DD grew 33%. I imagine at some point the industry matures and S&M budget subsides.

roenxi 6y ago
The core business model is they pick the food up in one place and put it down in a different place. "Market share" is not meaningful, there is about as low a barrier to entry for competition as it is possible to get. It isn't an achievement to gain 100% market share if each transaction makes a loss. If they try to raise prices to neutral or profitable levels it is likely that the market will shrink and competitors will charge in. It may be that the equilibrium market is restaurants and food outlets do their own delivery for free or at cost. Then there isn't much of a market for a service like DoorDash to make a profit in. It is possible that there is a market there and DoorDash will one day, somehow, make more money than they spend. But having a high market share is not much compensation when it requires constant losses to maintain.
- paloaltoasshole 6y ago
  Market share is absolutely meaningful here. You are assuming that Doordash is losing money on each delivery. They do not in most markets.

three_seagrass 6y ago

They're excluded from revenue - i.e. $40 order that is $5 discounted is $35 revenue.

MarkyC4 6y ago
Disclaimer: I haven't read the article. My understanding is sometimes companies fudge the numbers though. If a $40 order has a $5 discount, they might consider $40 as revenue and put the $5 discount under a marketing expense
- remote_phone 6y ago
  This is absolutely incorrect. You cannot take a discount as marketing expense and claim the full revenue. That is basic accounting that is not up for interpretation. If done intentionally it’s fraudulent.
  - belval 6y ago
    This comment was downvoted, which seems to imply that it's false. Is it? I know nothing about the laws of accounting and I am curious if you can truly offload discounts into marketing expenses.
    - arcticbull 6y ago
      So there's two kinds of accounting, GAAP and non-GAAP. A great example of non-GAAP accounting was WeWork's "community-adjusted EBITDA." When you use non-GAAP metrics to measure your business, you get to kind of define the standard by which you're measuring yourself. You get to do things exactly like the parent suggested, where you count 100% of the income as revenue and all your incentive spending as "marketing expenses." Uber does this too, for instance (back when it was a thing) 100% of the sticker price of an Uber Pool ride was reported as revenue while only the 30% cut of an UberX or Uber Black was reported as revenue, and yes, they would list driver incentives as marketing expenses.
      - 6y ago