3 ms·

"Coming from both the left and right, and around the world, we have devoted our careers to protecting people. Current lockdown policies are producing devastatin

"Coming from both the left and right, and around the world, we have devoted our careers to protecting people. Current lockdown policies are producing devastating effects on short and long-term public health. The results (to name a few) include lower childhood vaccination rates, worsening cardiovascular disease outcomes, fewer cancer screenings and deteriorating mental health – leading to greater excess mortality in years to come, with the working class and younger members of society carrying the heaviest burden. Keeping students out of school is a grave injustice. Keeping these measures in place until a vaccine is available will cause irreparable damage, with the underprivileged disproportionately harmed." http://gbdeclaration.org/ http://gbdeclaration.org/

f38zf5vdt 6y ago
I really lament that HackerNews has become just another outlet for political propaganda and manipulation. It didn't used to be this bad, but now there's large scale brigading of the top comment sections just like at reddit. I don't know what the solution is, but the reddit/HackerNews model of discussion definitely has its downsides in the face of malicious actors.
- roody15 6y ago
  Sadly it looks the US has really moved rapidly to copy the China style internet monitoring and control. Astroturfing everywhere has really ramped up. So much noise...
- robhunter 6y ago
  This reads as the equivalent of an ad hominem argument - why not address your concerns with the merits of what was said, rather than just dismiss it as propaganda?
  - f38zf5vdt 6y ago
    The same link has been posted several times in this thread by several accounts, all in a similar manner. Several days ago there was another COVID19 posting with "FREE MICHIGAN" and similar bizarre, anti-intellectual ramblings. Unfortunately HackerNews/YCombinator is the one controlling the identities on this website, so without access to more information I'm unable to discern much about the authorship of these comments.
    - roody15 6y ago
      I posted the link. I a system admin for a organization with 900 employees. Think using anti-intellectual rambling is unfair and overly simplistic. No problem if you disagree about best response to covid but leave room to hear some opposing viewpoints without labeling them bizarre or rants.
    - dang 6y ago
      That's why the site guidelines specifically ask people not to post accusations of astroturfing or brigading without evidence: "Please don't post insinuations about astroturfing, shilling, brigading, foreign agents and the like. It degrades discussion and is usually mistaken. If you're worried about abuse, email hn@ycombinator.com and we'll look at the data." https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html Users are overwhelmingly (as in, thousands of times) too quick to assume organized malice as an explanation for material that they don't like appearing on the internet. This is a symptom of how divided society is on divisive topics. People disagree, but they don't believe that the disagreements are legitimate. For a site like HN, accusations like what you posted are much more toxic than the problem you're complaining about. There's tons of past explanation here: https://hn.algolia.com/?sort=byDate&dateRange=all&type=comment&storyText=false&prefix=true&page=0&query=by:dang%20astroturf https://hn.algolia.com/?sort=byDate&dateRange=all&type=comme... Before anyone comes out with "dang says astroturfing doesn't exist"—no, the point is that there are two problems: real astroturfing, and imaginary internet accusations about it. Anyone assuming only the former is making a huge mistake. So what's the solution? Obviously we have to try to distinguish between the one and the other based on some sort of objective evidence. It's not enough to dislike someone else's view on a difficult topic like Covid and then say "brigading!"

f38zf5vdt 6y ago

I really lament that HackerNews has become just another outlet for political propaganda and manipulation. It didn't used to be this bad, but now there's large scale brigading of the top comment sections just like at reddit. I don't know what the solution is, but the reddit/HackerNews model of discussion definitely has its downsides in the face of malicious actors.

roody15 6y ago
Sadly it looks the US has really moved rapidly to copy the China style internet monitoring and control. Astroturfing everywhere has really ramped up. So much noise...
robhunter 6y ago
This reads as the equivalent of an ad hominem argument - why not address your concerns with the merits of what was said, rather than just dismiss it as propaganda?
- f38zf5vdt 6y ago
  The same link has been posted several times in this thread by several accounts, all in a similar manner. Several days ago there was another COVID19 posting with "FREE MICHIGAN" and similar bizarre, anti-intellectual ramblings. Unfortunately HackerNews/YCombinator is the one controlling the identities on this website, so without access to more information I'm unable to discern much about the authorship of these comments.
  - roody15 6y ago
    I posted the link. I a system admin for a organization with 900 employees. Think using anti-intellectual rambling is unfair and overly simplistic. No problem if you disagree about best response to covid but leave room to hear some opposing viewpoints without labeling them bizarre or rants.
  - dang 6y ago
    That's why the site guidelines specifically ask people not to post accusations of astroturfing or brigading without evidence: "Please don't post insinuations about astroturfing, shilling, brigading, foreign agents and the like. It degrades discussion and is usually mistaken. If you're worried about abuse, email hn@ycombinator.com and we'll look at the data." https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html Users are overwhelmingly (as in, thousands of times) too quick to assume organized malice as an explanation for material that they don't like appearing on the internet. This is a symptom of how divided society is on divisive topics. People disagree, but they don't believe that the disagreements are legitimate. For a site like HN, accusations like what you posted are much more toxic than the problem you're complaining about. There's tons of past explanation here: https://hn.algolia.com/?sort=byDate&dateRange=all&type=comment&storyText=false&prefix=true&page=0&query=by:dang%20astroturf https://hn.algolia.com/?sort=byDate&dateRange=all&type=comme... Before anyone comes out with "dang says astroturfing doesn't exist"—no, the point is that there are two problems: real astroturfing, and imaginary internet accusations about it. Anyone assuming only the former is making a huge mistake. So what's the solution? Obviously we have to try to distinguish between the one and the other based on some sort of objective evidence. It's not enough to dislike someone else's view on a difficult topic like Covid and then say "brigading!"