4 ms·

I think you should stick to Apple, frankly. Every time Apple comes up with something new (or just a new software release), people come out of their sheds to war

I think you should stick to Apple, frankly. Every time Apple comes up with something new (or just a new software release), people come out of their sheds to warn about all the bad things that will happen. And then almost none of those bad things happen. I've witnessed this dozens of times now, so a safe interpretation would be to assume that this time none of those things happen.

ant6n 6y ago
Not running 32bit code anymore die definitely happen
- coldtea 6y ago
  And it couldn't have happened sooner. Do you want to be burdened with layers of backwards compatibility and end up like POSIX or Autoconf with provisions for things that once run on some long forgotten UNIX OS version?
  - epse 6y ago
    32 bit support certainly isn't going to Bury you in backwards compatibility. It just runs
    - coldtea 6y ago
      Just runs with 2 versions of the same library (32/64), and with older programs that can't take advantage of 64bit ABI / arch changes...
- pfranz 6y ago
  It was rumored for like a decade. The last 32-bit computers were sold in something like 2007-2008? High Sierra started throwing warnings when you launched 32-bit apps. In 2018, they announced Mojave would be the last version to support them. Mojave just got an update yesterday and will likely get updates for at least another year. So nobody has been forced out yet. I'm aware end users with discontinued software were forced into some no-win choices. But as an ecosystem, it's one example where this happened and was given a ~15 year possible window and an explicit 4 year window to transition.
toyg 6y ago
Except bad things did happen. Like their capricious application of Appstore “guidelines”; the increasing difficulty of running software on Mac where the developer won’t pay Apple a tithe; the drop in Linux support for the platform, as they locked it down more and more at hardware level; the imposition of their authentication and payment portals (and hence 30% taxes all around) on web apps... etc etc etc. We have been effectively boiled like obedient frogs. I love macOS but my next laptop won’t be a mac and my next phone won’t be an iPhone. Divesting from the ecosystem will be painful but we’re well past any grace period at this point.
- sokoloff 6y ago
  I have not experienced any difficulties in installing or running apps from outside the Mac app store (if that’s what you mean by paying Apple a tithe).
  - toyg 6y ago
    First they restricted execution of unsigned binaries unless you run in a substantially-unprotected mode: https://github.molgen.mpg.de/pages/bs/macOSnotes/mac/mac_procs_unsigned.html https://github.molgen.mpg.de/pages/bs/macOSnotes/mac/mac_pro... Then they disabled execution of all unsigned binaries. To run on a default Mac, you either pay Apple or compile on the user's own machine which is obviously unsustainable. https://eclecticlight.co/2020/08/22/apple-silicon-macs-will-require-signed-code/ https://eclecticlight.co/2020/08/22/apple-silicon-macs-will-... They've also removed any 32bit support, in case you could make do with old programs that don't make Apple some money. I'm still on Mojave and will not upgrade. Personally, my last MBP was bought in 2016 and I have no intention of getting another one as long as they continue exploiting developers and the public in this way.
    - saagarjha 6y ago
      > To run on a default Mac, you either pay Apple or compile on the user's own machine This is not true. Apple silicon runs code with any signature, even an ad-hoc one.

ant6n 6y ago

Not running 32bit code anymore die definitely happen

coldtea 6y ago
And it couldn't have happened sooner. Do you want to be burdened with layers of backwards compatibility and end up like POSIX or Autoconf with provisions for things that once run on some long forgotten UNIX OS version?
- epse 6y ago
  32 bit support certainly isn't going to Bury you in backwards compatibility. It just runs
  - coldtea 6y ago
    Just runs with 2 versions of the same library (32/64), and with older programs that can't take advantage of 64bit ABI / arch changes...
pfranz 6y ago
It was rumored for like a decade. The last 32-bit computers were sold in something like 2007-2008? High Sierra started throwing warnings when you launched 32-bit apps. In 2018, they announced Mojave would be the last version to support them. Mojave just got an update yesterday and will likely get updates for at least another year. So nobody has been forced out yet. I'm aware end users with discontinued software were forced into some no-win choices. But as an ecosystem, it's one example where this happened and was given a ~15 year possible window and an explicit 4 year window to transition.

toyg 6y ago

Except bad things did happen. Like their capricious application of Appstore “guidelines”; the increasing difficulty of running software on Mac where the developer won’t pay Apple a tithe; the drop in Linux support for the platform, as they locked it down more and more at hardware level; the imposition of their authentication and payment portals (and hence 30% taxes all around) on web apps... etc etc etc. We have been effectively boiled like obedient frogs. I love macOS but my next laptop won’t be a mac and my next phone won’t be an iPhone. Divesting from the ecosystem will be painful but we’re well past any grace period at this point.

sokoloff 6y ago
I have not experienced any difficulties in installing or running apps from outside the Mac app store (if that’s what you mean by paying Apple a tithe).
- toyg 6y ago
  First they restricted execution of unsigned binaries unless you run in a substantially-unprotected mode: https://github.molgen.mpg.de/pages/bs/macOSnotes/mac/mac_procs_unsigned.html https://github.molgen.mpg.de/pages/bs/macOSnotes/mac/mac_pro... Then they disabled execution of all unsigned binaries. To run on a default Mac, you either pay Apple or compile on the user's own machine which is obviously unsustainable. https://eclecticlight.co/2020/08/22/apple-silicon-macs-will-require-signed-code/ https://eclecticlight.co/2020/08/22/apple-silicon-macs-will-... They've also removed any 32bit support, in case you could make do with old programs that don't make Apple some money. I'm still on Mojave and will not upgrade. Personally, my last MBP was bought in 2016 and I have no intention of getting another one as long as they continue exploiting developers and the public in this way.
  - saagarjha 6y ago
    > To run on a default Mac, you either pay Apple or compile on the user's own machine This is not true. Apple silicon runs code with any signature, even an ad-hoc one.