6 ms·

I don't disagree with your thesis, but I should point out that I have been using Vim almost exclusively for almost six years now (well, NeoVim for 4 of those ye

I don't disagree with your thesis, but I should point out that I have been using Vim almost exclusively for almost six years now (well, NeoVim for 4 of those years), and my config is only about 40 lines, and most of it is just installing plugins for whatever languages I'm using. Despite me not hacking it like crazy, I still think it really shines as an editor; Vim macros were sort of life-changing to me once they clicked for me. I also just think that modal editing is superior once you get past the initial learning curve.

hwayne 6y ago
There are many ways to use vim and they're all valid! People who love barebones vim are cool. People who love configuring vim are cool. People who love embedding vim in larger programs are cool. We have way more in common than vim squabblers pretend!
- Scarbutt 6y ago
  Are evil users cool too? BTW, your main point about using vim is emacs greatest strength.
  - hwayne 6y ago
    You wound me greatly, but yes, evil users are cool too. I mean, I first learned vim keybindings from Kile. (People keep telling me I'd love emacs, and I have nothing against it, I just happened to learn vim first.)
    - hsitz 6y ago
      Along with Evil, Emacs org-mode is the thing that eventually lures a number of people like you over from Vim. Evil makes editing in Emacs close enough (very close) to editing in Vim. Org-mode gives useful functionality that you can't get in Vim.
      - mijoharas 6y ago
        So, I am now a longtime emacs (and evil, love vim-ey things) user, and I've dipped my toes in the org-mode water a few times, but it's never quite stuck. Have you got any suggestions? The number of people that recommend it makes me sure that there's value to be had there, but it's never really become a habit for me.
        Scarbutt 6y ago
        The important part is to find a method and then leverage orgmode for it. With out some system is hard to make it stick.
ogre_codes 6y ago
Let me back up a step here. I use VIM for almost all basic editing. Its muscle memory. But for code editing, I generally end up on VSCode because it seems to have better language support. I've spent a fair amount of time with configuring VIM trying to get where I feel it needs to be. But whenever I shift to a new stack, it always seems to take an investment of time and effort to get VIM set where it's better than VSCode.
- GrantZvolsky 6y ago
  I share your experience, but it should only be a matter of time until the vim LSP clients[1] mature. One notable exception is Go with its [vim-go](https://github.com/fatih/vim-go https://github.com/fatih/vim-go) plugin, which feels very mature to me as someone new to the language. [1]: https://langserver.org/ https://langserver.org/
  - deadbunny 6y ago
    CoC is already there: https://github.com/neoclide/coc.nvim https://github.com/neoclide/coc.nvim
    - blandflakes 6y ago
      Having to install node.js for a language server client is sort of a downer. For this reason I've been eagerly awaiting the built-in client in neovim, though it's definitely less polished and feature-complete than CoC today.
      - deadbunny 6y ago
        Isn't the "built in" neovim language server lua? I personally can't see much difference between having to install nodejs runtime Vs the lua runtime.
        igneo676 6y ago
        The difference is that the lua runtime is embedded (and wicked fast) into Neovim vs nodejs that has to go over the remote plugin interface
tzs 6y ago
About 40 lines sounds reasonable to me. I've been using vim and before that other vi clones or actual vi as one of my main editors for 40 years, and my .vimrc is 60 lines. 20 of those are to automatically decrypt on read and encrypt on write .gpg or .asc files, which I copied from somewhere 20-25 years ago and haven't actually used in 15+ years, leaving only 40 lines I actually care about.
- alwillis 6y ago
  Just as an FYI, Vim has built-in support for encryption: https://vim.fandom.com/wiki/Encryption https://vim.fandom.com/wiki/Encryption

hwayne 6y ago

There are many ways to use vim and they're all valid! People who love barebones vim are cool. People who love configuring vim are cool. People who love embedding vim in larger programs are cool. We have way more in common than vim squabblers pretend!

Scarbutt 6y ago
Are evil users cool too? BTW, your main point about using vim is emacs greatest strength.
- hwayne 6y ago
  You wound me greatly, but yes, evil users are cool too. I mean, I first learned vim keybindings from Kile. (People keep telling me I'd love emacs, and I have nothing against it, I just happened to learn vim first.)
  - hsitz 6y ago
    Along with Evil, Emacs org-mode is the thing that eventually lures a number of people like you over from Vim. Evil makes editing in Emacs close enough (very close) to editing in Vim. Org-mode gives useful functionality that you can't get in Vim.
    - mijoharas 6y ago
      So, I am now a longtime emacs (and evil, love vim-ey things) user, and I've dipped my toes in the org-mode water a few times, but it's never quite stuck. Have you got any suggestions? The number of people that recommend it makes me sure that there's value to be had there, but it's never really become a habit for me.
      - Scarbutt 6y ago
        The important part is to find a method and then leverage orgmode for it. With out some system is hard to make it stick.

ogre_codes 6y ago

Let me back up a step here. I use VIM for almost all basic editing. Its muscle memory. But for code editing, I generally end up on VSCode because it seems to have better language support. I've spent a fair amount of time with configuring VIM trying to get where I feel it needs to be. But whenever I shift to a new stack, it always seems to take an investment of time and effort to get VIM set where it's better than VSCode.

GrantZvolsky 6y ago
I share your experience, but it should only be a matter of time until the vim LSP clients[1] mature. One notable exception is Go with its [vim-go](https://github.com/fatih/vim-go https://github.com/fatih/vim-go) plugin, which feels very mature to me as someone new to the language. [1]: https://langserver.org/ https://langserver.org/
- deadbunny 6y ago
  CoC is already there: https://github.com/neoclide/coc.nvim https://github.com/neoclide/coc.nvim
  - blandflakes 6y ago
    Having to install node.js for a language server client is sort of a downer. For this reason I've been eagerly awaiting the built-in client in neovim, though it's definitely less polished and feature-complete than CoC today.
    - deadbunny 6y ago
      Isn't the "built in" neovim language server lua? I personally can't see much difference between having to install nodejs runtime Vs the lua runtime.
      - igneo676 6y ago
        The difference is that the lua runtime is embedded (and wicked fast) into Neovim vs nodejs that has to go over the remote plugin interface

tzs 6y ago

About 40 lines sounds reasonable to me. I've been using vim and before that other vi clones or actual vi as one of my main editors for 40 years, and my .vimrc is 60 lines. 20 of those are to automatically decrypt on read and encrypt on write .gpg or .asc files, which I copied from somewhere 20-25 years ago and haven't actually used in 15+ years, leaving only 40 lines I actually care about.

alwillis 6y ago
Just as an FYI, Vim has built-in support for encryption: https://vim.fandom.com/wiki/Encryption https://vim.fandom.com/wiki/Encryption