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> Safari … the world’s fastest browser I actually kind of like WebKit as an engine that so many small independent browsers can be based on, but to me this is a

> Safari … the world’s fastest browser I actually kind of like WebKit as an engine that so many small independent browsers can be based on, but to me this is an interesting example of just how grounded in reality this marketing copy is.

snazz 6y ago
The JetStream, MotionMark, and Speedometer benchmarks are fairly "grounded in reality", don't you think? That's where the speed claims come from on this page: https://www.apple.com/safari/ https://www.apple.com/safari/
- boogies 6y ago
  I have no expertise in this, but I think it’s a safe bet that every major vendor can find benchmarks that favor their particular browser. (Edit: and https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=25073625 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=25073625 should make it quite easy for Apple)
  - alwillis 6y ago
    Not in this case, especially when Apple calls out Chrome and Firefox and they haven't said otherwise. These are the industry standard benchmarks, so there's that.
    - saagarjha 6y ago
      Do note that browserbench.org is run by Apple. Which doesn't quite mean it's wrong but that's what WebKit specifically optimizes for.
    - jeffbee 6y ago
      Yeah, these are good indicators of real-world single thread performance. Way more useful than SPEC etc.
ogre_codes 6y ago
It's certainly the most battery efficient browser which suggests to me they are doing something right with performance. A lot of this seems to involve how deep down browser specific behaviors the developer goes. I've seen a few pages that work better under Chrome than Safari. Even big Storybook sites seem to do better under Chrome.
wffurr 6y ago
That's great that it's fast, but do they have WebGL 2 support on by default yet? Six years and counting on the WebKit bug: https://bugs.webkit.org/show_bug.cgi?id=126404 https://bugs.webkit.org/show_bug.cgi?id=126404 WebGL 2 is required for MSAA-enabled offscreen framebuffers among other features that aren't available in WebGL 1 as extensions.
- saagarjha 6y ago
  I saw a commit go in for that: https://bugs.webkit.org/show_bug.cgi?id=216464 https://bugs.webkit.org/show_bug.cgi?id=216464. Not sure if they put that in the Safari build yet.
- modeless 6y ago
  Almost! WebGL 2 is now enabled by default in Safari Technology Preview, as of September. Please give it a try now before it goes out in a Safari release and file bugs if you see any issues.
  - wffurr 6y ago
    Big Sur update has taken down developer.apple.com (along with the hash checker OCSP service). I will try again tomorrow.
  - wffurr 6y ago
    I just tried it out with the rendering engine used on keep.google.com for drawing notes (among others) and it works flawlessly with WebGL 2. Thanks for the hard work! Looking forward to it rolling out on by default in Safari.

snazz 6y ago

The JetStream, MotionMark, and Speedometer benchmarks are fairly "grounded in reality", don't you think? That's where the speed claims come from on this page: https://www.apple.com/safari/ https://www.apple.com/safari/

boogies 6y ago
I have no expertise in this, but I think it’s a safe bet that every major vendor can find benchmarks that favor their particular browser. (Edit: and https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=25073625 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=25073625 should make it quite easy for Apple)
- alwillis 6y ago
  Not in this case, especially when Apple calls out Chrome and Firefox and they haven't said otherwise. These are the industry standard benchmarks, so there's that.
  - saagarjha 6y ago
    Do note that browserbench.org is run by Apple. Which doesn't quite mean it's wrong but that's what WebKit specifically optimizes for.
  - jeffbee 6y ago
    Yeah, these are good indicators of real-world single thread performance. Way more useful than SPEC etc.

ogre_codes 6y ago

It's certainly the most battery efficient browser which suggests to me they are doing something right with performance. A lot of this seems to involve how deep down browser specific behaviors the developer goes. I've seen a few pages that work better under Chrome than Safari. Even big Storybook sites seem to do better under Chrome.

wffurr 6y ago

That's great that it's fast, but do they have WebGL 2 support on by default yet? Six years and counting on the WebKit bug: https://bugs.webkit.org/show_bug.cgi?id=126404 https://bugs.webkit.org/show_bug.cgi?id=126404 WebGL 2 is required for MSAA-enabled offscreen framebuffers among other features that aren't available in WebGL 1 as extensions.

saagarjha 6y ago
I saw a commit go in for that: https://bugs.webkit.org/show_bug.cgi?id=216464 https://bugs.webkit.org/show_bug.cgi?id=216464. Not sure if they put that in the Safari build yet.
modeless 6y ago
Almost! WebGL 2 is now enabled by default in Safari Technology Preview, as of September. Please give it a try now before it goes out in a Safari release and file bugs if you see any issues.
- wffurr 6y ago
  Big Sur update has taken down developer.apple.com (along with the hash checker OCSP service). I will try again tomorrow.
- wffurr 6y ago
  I just tried it out with the rendering engine used on keep.google.com for drawing notes (among others) and it works flawlessly with WebGL 2. Thanks for the hard work! Looking forward to it rolling out on by default in Safari.