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I get bored with this kind of argument because it always ignores magnitude and nuance. Yes there other factors but height tends to be a prerequisite before the

I get bored with this kind of argument because it always ignores magnitude and nuance. Yes there other factors but height tends to be a prerequisite before they apply. Odds goes exponentially down based on how far from the mean you are. 5'9" vs. 5'5" is a world of difference. 'Success' is also not Boolean. I know very successful short guys who have had zero success with women. Talking in blasé terms 'oh it is just one of many factors' is like saying possessing functioning legs is just one of many factors a footballer requires. Or having enough petrol is one of many factors in a car functioning properly. It's true but kind of missing the point. The really interesting point is why people are so in denial about this fact that is so blatantly obvious. I suspect it is a mix of those without this issue wanting to think their success was all attributable to their own skills, people not liking the idea that something uncontrollable could screw you so bad, women feeling it is an attack (it isn't at all), those who are shorter but not significantly below the mean having success (though reduced) and thinking it must apply to those shorter than them, etc. Another interesting thing I have noticed is that short men is one of the few remaining immutable characteristics society allows people to mock openly. "What is she doing with that little squirt" is something I heard from a friend recently without a hint of self-awareness.

toyg 6y ago
I can only talk for my experience - I’m 5’8” and over 40, and I don’t think height has ever made much of a difference in my relationships (or rather lack thereof), whereas my general appearance and dullness definitely did at various points. I still reckon that if I were ripped and/or better looking and/or rich and/or wittier, it would make a world of difference, whereas an extra few inches alone would not. I know taller guys with much less “pull” than me, and shorter ones who kill it year after year. But I guess I don’t know anyone smaller than 5’6”. On the mocking, I agree but hopefully that’s slowly going away. It’s one of those things, like casual racism and casual sexism, that will take a while to fully disappear from everyday conversations. Some animal instincts are just what they are.
- barnacled 6y ago
  the difference between 5'8" and 5'5" is massive. And again it's nuanced, it's a prerequisite and MASSIVE but there are other factors once a woman's past that. Most of the examples of guys who do well at very short height are either - some MASSIVE compensation in some other way (hugely confident, etc.) with a MASSIVE failure rate, or they are actually in a dating pool with a lower male height. Obviously exceptions happen (I'm engaged for one!) but the impact it has is massive and I didn't know until my mid 20's, nobody wanted to admit it or talk about it and it would have saved me a lot of pain to know.

toyg 6y ago

I can only talk for my experience - I’m 5’8” and over 40, and I don’t think height has ever made much of a difference in my relationships (or rather lack thereof), whereas my general appearance and dullness definitely did at various points. I still reckon that if I were ripped and/or better looking and/or rich and/or wittier, it would make a world of difference, whereas an extra few inches alone would not. I know taller guys with much less “pull” than me, and shorter ones who kill it year after year. But I guess I don’t know anyone smaller than 5’6”. On the mocking, I agree but hopefully that’s slowly going away. It’s one of those things, like casual racism and casual sexism, that will take a while to fully disappear from everyday conversations. Some animal instincts are just what they are.

barnacled 6y ago
the difference between 5'8" and 5'5" is massive. And again it's nuanced, it's a prerequisite and MASSIVE but there are other factors once a woman's past that. Most of the examples of guys who do well at very short height are either - some MASSIVE compensation in some other way (hugely confident, etc.) with a MASSIVE failure rate, or they are actually in a dating pool with a lower male height. Obviously exceptions happen (I'm engaged for one!) but the impact it has is massive and I didn't know until my mid 20's, nobody wanted to admit it or talk about it and it would have saved me a lot of pain to know.