6 ms·

Summary (from the speech broadcast on CNN): * In August '10 a lead was uncovered. Obama directed followup. * Lead was strengthened over time until it was isol

by pnathan 16y ago

Summary (from the speech broadcast on CNN): * In August '10 a lead was uncovered. Obama directed followup. * Lead was strengthened over time until it was isolated that bin Laden was in a compound in Pakistan. * Obama gave the order and an American commando team went in, had a firefight, and killed bin Laden. His body was brought out. * No Americans were harmed, and civilians were attempted to be protected. * The Pakistani government was notified (speech did not say if this was pre-event or post-event). And, transcript! http://www.whitehouse.gov/blog/2011/05/02/osama-bin-laden-dead http://www.whitehouse.gov/blog/2011/05/02/osama-bin-laden-de...

calebmpeterson 16y ago
Thank you for giving the most informative and least speculative post in this thread!
- pnathan 16y ago
  You're welcome. I hope to find a transcript and append a link to it. As of several minutes ago, the White House had not released a transcript.
  - calebmpeterson 16y ago
    Just read the transcript; thank you for posting it.
dgallagher 16y ago
The firefight took place in Abbottabad, Pakistan: Wiki: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Abbottabad http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Abbottabad Maps: http://maps.google.com/maps?hl=en&client=safari&q=abbottabad+pakistan&ie=UTF8&hq=&hnear=Abbottābad,+Abbottabad,+Khyber+Pakhtunkhwa,+Pakistan&gl=us&ll=34.145446,73.221688&spn=0.033528,0.065875&z=15 http://maps.google.com/maps?hl=en&client=safari&q=ab... Google Earth (copy/paste): 34° 8'48.00"N 73°12'59.00"E
- thematt 16y ago
  That is way more populated than where I was expecting we would find him. Speculation had been going on for years that he was in a cave in the mountains of Pakistan or some remote village. I see a college, drugstores and even a movie theater on that map. The mere fact that his location was mappable by Google is surprising.
  - joe24pack 16y ago
    Not really, hiding in plain sight is a common tactic.
  - haribilalic 16y ago
    It's easy to imagine that someone like Osama would be hiding in a cave or like Saddam in a "spider hole", but hiding in populated areas isn't uncommon. Karadzic was also hiding in plain sight in Belgrade and Vienna while on the "run". He had, however, adopted a new identity. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arrest_and_prosecution_of_Radovan_Karadžić http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arrest_and_prosecution_of_Radov...
    - nagnatron 16y ago
      He also participated in a few TV shows and no one recognized him.
  - gexla 16y ago
    Looks like he could even brush up on his hockey and golf skills. Apparently that's a good place to hide out if you need to. Next up, Zawahiri (edited.) Considering that Osama was in a mansion outside of Islamabad, I would expect Zawahiri (edited) to be in a beach house outside of Karachi. Edit: Imagine being the guy who pulled the trigger. I will never cheer anyone's death, but Osama would likely not allowed himself to be taken alive. Buy a beer / coke / shot (whatever he prefers) for the shooter. These guys are military hackers, maybe they read this as well. Edit: Whoops, got wrong name of #2. blush
    - 16y ago
zheng 16y ago
A minor detail, but the word used to describe his location was "compound", which might give a very different interpretation than villa. Not saying villa is wrong, just offering the source material for people to consider.
- pnathan 16y ago
  thanks, fixing.
DufusM 16y ago
It will be very interesting to know if Pakistani military was completely unaware of his location until the US got this intel, or if this intel was obtained through a section of the military/govt who was somehow pressurized to give it up. There has always been some suspicion that there were elements in Pakistan sympathetic to Al Qaeda who were harboring bin Laden.
- originalgeek 16y ago
  I believe they simply paid someone enough to give up the goods.
- nikcub 16y ago
  The division in Pakistan is that the military is pro government (and vice verse, since this government came into power in a line of military coups) but that the ISI is anti. The army is more moderate, while the ISI is radical The ISI overthrew the old government in Afghanistan by arming and training large groups of students from local pakistani madrasas. The student group after a few key wins in the south went on to be known as taleban (which is tajik for students) These same factions within the ISI helped keep the Taleban in power, and assisted in aiding their escape back through Tora Bora and into Pakistan. I bet they tipped bin laden off to not staying in Wazrisistan and other tribal areas, since there was too much heat and the Pakistani military had some reach there. I bet that the military in Pakistan knew a little (nothing about timing) but that the ISI were told nothing. The CIA have been in an active war with the ISI in Pakistan since 2001. There was the incident last year[1] where a CIA agent killed two ISI officers who were following him. I think that incident must be linked to bin laden tracking, since the agent - Raymond Davis, had been visiting the Pakistani countryside and taking photos of various compounds. When the ISI found out, they had him followed and intimidated him into leaving the country and minding their own business. The CIA doesn't take shit and shot the other agents in their own country, then got Davies released by the Pakistani gov as part of a plea deal I can't wait for the books and stories to come out about the last 2-3 years in Afghanistan and Pakistan - there is a real gap in public knowledge in terms of what has been happening there, and I bet some of the most interesting stories of the entire war on terrorism happen in that time. The biggest problem always was that one of our key allies in the war had its own internal problems - and one side of our allie directly created and supported the very enemy we were fighting and continued to support them. I don't doubt for a second that at least some elements of the ISI knew where bin laden was and protected him. The same thing happen in Serbia, with elements of the army and special police protecting Karadzic and Mladic, who is still at large. [1] story on Raymond Davis, the CIA agent who shot two ISI agents in Pakistan last year: http://www.foreignpolicy.com/articles/2011/03/11/spy_games?page=full http://www.foreignpolicy.com/articles/2011/03/11/spy_games?p...
shadowsun7 16y ago
The New York Times has just released a 7 page obituary profiling the life and influence of Osama Bin Laden: http://www.nytimes.com/2011/05/02/world/02osama-bin-laden-obituary.html?hp=&pagewanted=all http://www.nytimes.com/2011/05/02/world/02osama-bin-laden-ob... It's a great read. I'm wondering how they pulled it off, though - did they have the copy for an obituary filed away, and pulled it out and edited when the news broke?
- marshray 16y ago
  did they have the copy for an obituary filed away, and pulled it out and edited when the news broke? Yes, that's how they do it. It used to be that hilarity would ensue when people found news orgs' internal web servers exposed on the net. Don't recall it happening in awhile though. Guess they learned their lesson.
- jdp23 16y ago
  Yes, newspapers have ready-to-go obits for important people on the shelf, ready for updating with death info for situations like this
- pak 16y ago
  Yep, that's exactly how obit departments at major media outlets operate. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Obituary#Media http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Obituary#Media
- ridruejo 16y ago
  Yes, it is common practice. Sometimes they accidentally publish some of this obituaries, which leads to some embarrassing situations :)
- dporan 16y ago
  Yes, apparently it's a common practice: http://www.slate.com/id/2226505/ http://www.slate.com/id/2226505/
- tcskeptic 16y ago
  Yes, newspapers keep obituaries of significant figures on file and updated.
elliottcarlson 16y ago
According to Al Jazeera, Abbottabad is a garrison town requiring multiple military checkpoints to gain entrance and say it seems more than likely that the Pakistani military knew where Bin Laden was and were harboring him.
- abbasmehdi 16y ago
  Yes, in that part of the world this is a well known fact, it is actually a love triangle and includes the CIA. It's the innocents who pay the price on both sides.
abbasmehdi 16y ago
Hmmm, sounds like a made up story, his services were no longer needed. Ask any journalist or citizen of Pak. Pakistan is represented in the US media either by its military or the political party in power, and both live off US aid hence never go of the script. OBL was just a scarecrow.
- marshray 16y ago
  Assuming a body is actually produced, what are you going to produce to support your claim that the story of how it was obtained is "made up"?
  - abbasmehdi 16y ago
    Oh no he is dead for sure (his services not needed anymore means execution), but its made up as in clear cut cops and robbers. The US has engaged in such theatrical for decades in that part of the world. General Zia was another example, its the old "prop up, villainize, create military passage, burn all evidence" tactic. Also used in South America, now in Libya, etc.
    - marshray 16y ago
      That would be "nothing" then. OK, sorry to waste everyone's time.
    - abbasmehdi 16y ago
      After 9/11 when Bush wanted to invade Iraq we would walk for peace, passing drivers would throw stuff at us, even tell us to "go home" despite all of us being americans, this reminds me of that day, the vehement opposition without proper investigation is the sign of another heard running towards the edge of the cliff.
      - marshray 16y ago
        This isn't that. This is people on HN downvoting you because you are failing to display a sufficient capacity for logical thought. Bringing in more and more emotional scenery isn't helping. It's a predictable and transparent rhetorical tactic that we've all seen used in desperation many times before. There are plenty of other sites where that kind of stuff is appreciated and even encouraged. Take it there and you'll get a better response.
haberman 16y ago
> Obama gave the order and an American commando team went in, had a firefight, and killed bin Laden. One thing that was unclear to me is if Bin Laden died in the firefight or was killed afterwards. From the article: "After a firefight, they killed Osama bin Laden and took custody of his body."
mikeknoop 16y ago
This guy live-tweeted the raid on OBL without knowing it: http://twitter.com/ReallyVirtual http://twitter.com/ReallyVirtual

by pnathan 16y ago

calebmpeterson 16y ago

Thank you for giving the most informative and least speculative post in this thread!

pnathan 16y ago
You're welcome. I hope to find a transcript and append a link to it. As of several minutes ago, the White House had not released a transcript.
- calebmpeterson 16y ago
  Just read the transcript; thank you for posting it.

dgallagher 16y ago

The firefight took place in Abbottabad, Pakistan: Wiki: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Abbottabad http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Abbottabad Maps: http://maps.google.com/maps?hl=en&client=safari&q=abbottabad+pakistan&ie=UTF8&hq=&hnear=Abbottābad,+Abbottabad,+Khyber+Pakhtunkhwa,+Pakistan&gl=us&ll=34.145446,73.221688&spn=0.033528,0.065875&z=15 http://maps.google.com/maps?hl=en&client=safari&q=ab... Google Earth (copy/paste): 34° 8'48.00"N 73°12'59.00"E

thematt 16y ago
That is way more populated than where I was expecting we would find him. Speculation had been going on for years that he was in a cave in the mountains of Pakistan or some remote village. I see a college, drugstores and even a movie theater on that map. The mere fact that his location was mappable by Google is surprising.
- joe24pack 16y ago
  Not really, hiding in plain sight is a common tactic.
- haribilalic 16y ago
  It's easy to imagine that someone like Osama would be hiding in a cave or like Saddam in a "spider hole", but hiding in populated areas isn't uncommon. Karadzic was also hiding in plain sight in Belgrade and Vienna while on the "run". He had, however, adopted a new identity. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arrest_and_prosecution_of_Radovan_Karadžić http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arrest_and_prosecution_of_Radov...
  - nagnatron 16y ago
    He also participated in a few TV shows and no one recognized him.
- gexla 16y ago
  Looks like he could even brush up on his hockey and golf skills. Apparently that's a good place to hide out if you need to. Next up, Zawahiri (edited.) Considering that Osama was in a mansion outside of Islamabad, I would expect Zawahiri (edited) to be in a beach house outside of Karachi. Edit: Imagine being the guy who pulled the trigger. I will never cheer anyone's death, but Osama would likely not allowed himself to be taken alive. Buy a beer / coke / shot (whatever he prefers) for the shooter. These guys are military hackers, maybe they read this as well. Edit: Whoops, got wrong name of #2. blush
  - 16y ago

zheng 16y ago

A minor detail, but the word used to describe his location was "compound", which might give a very different interpretation than villa. Not saying villa is wrong, just offering the source material for people to consider.

pnathan 16y ago
thanks, fixing.

DufusM 16y ago

It will be very interesting to know if Pakistani military was completely unaware of his location until the US got this intel, or if this intel was obtained through a section of the military/govt who was somehow pressurized to give it up. There has always been some suspicion that there were elements in Pakistan sympathetic to Al Qaeda who were harboring bin Laden.

originalgeek 16y ago
I believe they simply paid someone enough to give up the goods.
nikcub 16y ago
The division in Pakistan is that the military is pro government (and vice verse, since this government came into power in a line of military coups) but that the ISI is anti. The army is more moderate, while the ISI is radical The ISI overthrew the old government in Afghanistan by arming and training large groups of students from local pakistani madrasas. The student group after a few key wins in the south went on to be known as taleban (which is tajik for students) These same factions within the ISI helped keep the Taleban in power, and assisted in aiding their escape back through Tora Bora and into Pakistan. I bet they tipped bin laden off to not staying in Wazrisistan and other tribal areas, since there was too much heat and the Pakistani military had some reach there. I bet that the military in Pakistan knew a little (nothing about timing) but that the ISI were told nothing. The CIA have been in an active war with the ISI in Pakistan since 2001. There was the incident last year[1] where a CIA agent killed two ISI officers who were following him. I think that incident must be linked to bin laden tracking, since the agent - Raymond Davis, had been visiting the Pakistani countryside and taking photos of various compounds. When the ISI found out, they had him followed and intimidated him into leaving the country and minding their own business. The CIA doesn't take shit and shot the other agents in their own country, then got Davies released by the Pakistani gov as part of a plea deal I can't wait for the books and stories to come out about the last 2-3 years in Afghanistan and Pakistan - there is a real gap in public knowledge in terms of what has been happening there, and I bet some of the most interesting stories of the entire war on terrorism happen in that time. The biggest problem always was that one of our key allies in the war had its own internal problems - and one side of our allie directly created and supported the very enemy we were fighting and continued to support them. I don't doubt for a second that at least some elements of the ISI knew where bin laden was and protected him. The same thing happen in Serbia, with elements of the army and special police protecting Karadzic and Mladic, who is still at large. [1] story on Raymond Davis, the CIA agent who shot two ISI agents in Pakistan last year: http://www.foreignpolicy.com/articles/2011/03/11/spy_games?page=full http://www.foreignpolicy.com/articles/2011/03/11/spy_games?p...

shadowsun7 16y ago

The New York Times has just released a 7 page obituary profiling the life and influence of Osama Bin Laden: http://www.nytimes.com/2011/05/02/world/02osama-bin-laden-obituary.html?hp=&pagewanted=all http://www.nytimes.com/2011/05/02/world/02osama-bin-laden-ob... It's a great read. I'm wondering how they pulled it off, though - did they have the copy for an obituary filed away, and pulled it out and edited when the news broke?

marshray 16y ago
did they have the copy for an obituary filed away, and pulled it out and edited when the news broke? Yes, that's how they do it. It used to be that hilarity would ensue when people found news orgs' internal web servers exposed on the net. Don't recall it happening in awhile though. Guess they learned their lesson.
jdp23 16y ago
Yes, newspapers have ready-to-go obits for important people on the shelf, ready for updating with death info for situations like this
pak 16y ago
Yep, that's exactly how obit departments at major media outlets operate. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Obituary#Media http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Obituary#Media
ridruejo 16y ago
Yes, it is common practice. Sometimes they accidentally publish some of this obituaries, which leads to some embarrassing situations :)
dporan 16y ago
Yes, apparently it's a common practice: http://www.slate.com/id/2226505/ http://www.slate.com/id/2226505/
tcskeptic 16y ago
Yes, newspapers keep obituaries of significant figures on file and updated.

elliottcarlson 16y ago

According to Al Jazeera, Abbottabad is a garrison town requiring multiple military checkpoints to gain entrance and say it seems more than likely that the Pakistani military knew where Bin Laden was and were harboring him.

abbasmehdi 16y ago
Yes, in that part of the world this is a well known fact, it is actually a love triangle and includes the CIA. It's the innocents who pay the price on both sides.

abbasmehdi 16y ago

Hmmm, sounds like a made up story, his services were no longer needed. Ask any journalist or citizen of Pak. Pakistan is represented in the US media either by its military or the political party in power, and both live off US aid hence never go of the script. OBL was just a scarecrow.

marshray 16y ago
Assuming a body is actually produced, what are you going to produce to support your claim that the story of how it was obtained is "made up"?
- abbasmehdi 16y ago
  Oh no he is dead for sure (his services not needed anymore means execution), but its made up as in clear cut cops and robbers. The US has engaged in such theatrical for decades in that part of the world. General Zia was another example, its the old "prop up, villainize, create military passage, burn all evidence" tactic. Also used in South America, now in Libya, etc.
  - marshray 16y ago
    That would be "nothing" then. OK, sorry to waste everyone's time.
  - abbasmehdi 16y ago
    After 9/11 when Bush wanted to invade Iraq we would walk for peace, passing drivers would throw stuff at us, even tell us to "go home" despite all of us being americans, this reminds me of that day, the vehement opposition without proper investigation is the sign of another heard running towards the edge of the cliff.
    - marshray 16y ago
      This isn't that. This is people on HN downvoting you because you are failing to display a sufficient capacity for logical thought. Bringing in more and more emotional scenery isn't helping. It's a predictable and transparent rhetorical tactic that we've all seen used in desperation many times before. There are plenty of other sites where that kind of stuff is appreciated and even encouraged. Take it there and you'll get a better response.

haberman 16y ago

> Obama gave the order and an American commando team went in, had a firefight, and killed bin Laden. One thing that was unclear to me is if Bin Laden died in the firefight or was killed afterwards. From the article: "After a firefight, they killed Osama bin Laden and took custody of his body."

mikeknoop 16y ago

This guy live-tweeted the raid on OBL without knowing it: http://twitter.com/ReallyVirtual http://twitter.com/ReallyVirtual