4 ms·

Yes, maybe if we keep trying very hard, someday we will also have books in America. (?) The arrogance of this comment is simply breathtaking.

dazc 6y ago
As a British subject, it's not surprising though. We are taught a lot of things about Americans which turn out not to be true, that you learn history via movies is one of these things that gets said now and again. I was chatting to someone the other day and asked if she'd been to America. No, she said, I can't stand Americans. Do you know any Americans, I asked. Of course she didn't but she has been to Canada and asked if I had. No, said I, I can't stand Canadians. She looked at me as if that was a ridiculous statement before realising I was being sarcastic. Go figure?
finikytou 6y ago
I live in the us and my experience is not only with 1 american but a majority of the americans I encountered (even ones educated at MIT or even in geopolitics at Georgetown), I feel that if we need to learn from movies we should all rewatch videodrome and think about the consequences of having partisan media. Also I was not implying that you do not have books in america... But you can just see in this comment section (where most of the people are educated) that most of the replies hints that they do not understand the election process hence backing my statement. The movies are obviously PC-Washing all history just like you removed your statues you are removing from your intellect everything that is not consensually approved and history has a lot that this new horde of censors of the good will not like. and the proof is that most the people reading this will downvote me using those censoring tools to destroy an opinion that they do not approve. What is breathtaking is to read comments like "wasnt the election done?" purely because you want to win and hate the system when it doesn't play in your favor.
- nkohari 6y ago
  I mean, if your argument is that we have uninformed people in America, I certainly won't disagree. That's different from the argument that "Americans don't understand civics because they watch movies instead of reading history books" which is frankly absurd and offensive. I'm not convinced that the number of civically-uninformed people is particularly higher in America when compared to elsewhere in the world. If you have data to that effect, please share it. For all intents and purposes the election is done. The votes have been cast and with most of them counted, Biden has won by a wide enough margin that sporadic concerns about voter fraud is not going to change it. Americans who are pushing back against Trump's reticence to concede are not doing so not because they believe that TV decides who is elected, but because it's a bald-faced attempt at a coup. Trump has every right to challenge the results in court, but if there was actual evidence of widespread election irregularities, it would have been presented by now.
  - finikytou 6y ago
    "I'm not convinced that the number of civically-uninformed people is particularly higher in America " I am convinced it is the case and it is because you guys totally eliminated debate from the public landscape and even more the media landscape. I was watching US election at the same time on a french channel vs an US channel. I was pretty sure the level of understanding and debate would be higher on the US channel (and I checked a few of them) but was astonished to see that actually there wasn't any real concrete and intelligent political analysis (ok just one on numbers using stats) or even one ounce of debate while on the french channel the debate invited experts, was intelligent, one side was conceiding things to trump and the others one fighting it using arguments rather than emotions. It is just mindblowing as an outsider to see that you totally removed debate from the equation and that any kind of debate/analysis is perceived as criticism or even worse racism/[add any bad word there] if it concedes things to trump.
    - nkohari 6y ago
      Let me get this straight: you're saying that Americans are too reliant on television for information, and to support your analysis you're watching cable news? We can both agree that there should be more healthy debate, both in general and in the media. So far though your argument has been that Americans are less civically-minded, and your supporting evidence has been a few people you talked to who mentioned movies and watching American infotainment television. This isn't a particularly useful or interesting conversation for me at this point, so I'm going to go back to work. Thanks!

dazc 6y ago

As a British subject, it's not surprising though. We are taught a lot of things about Americans which turn out not to be true, that you learn history via movies is one of these things that gets said now and again. I was chatting to someone the other day and asked if she'd been to America. No, she said, I can't stand Americans. Do you know any Americans, I asked. Of course she didn't but she has been to Canada and asked if I had. No, said I, I can't stand Canadians. She looked at me as if that was a ridiculous statement before realising I was being sarcastic. Go figure?

finikytou 6y ago

I live in the us and my experience is not only with 1 american but a majority of the americans I encountered (even ones educated at MIT or even in geopolitics at Georgetown), I feel that if we need to learn from movies we should all rewatch videodrome and think about the consequences of having partisan media. Also I was not implying that you do not have books in america... But you can just see in this comment section (where most of the people are educated) that most of the replies hints that they do not understand the election process hence backing my statement. The movies are obviously PC-Washing all history just like you removed your statues you are removing from your intellect everything that is not consensually approved and history has a lot that this new horde of censors of the good will not like. and the proof is that most the people reading this will downvote me using those censoring tools to destroy an opinion that they do not approve. What is breathtaking is to read comments like "wasnt the election done?" purely because you want to win and hate the system when it doesn't play in your favor.

nkohari 6y ago
I mean, if your argument is that we have uninformed people in America, I certainly won't disagree. That's different from the argument that "Americans don't understand civics because they watch movies instead of reading history books" which is frankly absurd and offensive. I'm not convinced that the number of civically-uninformed people is particularly higher in America when compared to elsewhere in the world. If you have data to that effect, please share it. For all intents and purposes the election is done. The votes have been cast and with most of them counted, Biden has won by a wide enough margin that sporadic concerns about voter fraud is not going to change it. Americans who are pushing back against Trump's reticence to concede are not doing so not because they believe that TV decides who is elected, but because it's a bald-faced attempt at a coup. Trump has every right to challenge the results in court, but if there was actual evidence of widespread election irregularities, it would have been presented by now.
- finikytou 6y ago
  "I'm not convinced that the number of civically-uninformed people is particularly higher in America " I am convinced it is the case and it is because you guys totally eliminated debate from the public landscape and even more the media landscape. I was watching US election at the same time on a french channel vs an US channel. I was pretty sure the level of understanding and debate would be higher on the US channel (and I checked a few of them) but was astonished to see that actually there wasn't any real concrete and intelligent political analysis (ok just one on numbers using stats) or even one ounce of debate while on the french channel the debate invited experts, was intelligent, one side was conceiding things to trump and the others one fighting it using arguments rather than emotions. It is just mindblowing as an outsider to see that you totally removed debate from the equation and that any kind of debate/analysis is perceived as criticism or even worse racism/[add any bad word there] if it concedes things to trump.
  - nkohari 6y ago
    Let me get this straight: you're saying that Americans are too reliant on television for information, and to support your analysis you're watching cable news? We can both agree that there should be more healthy debate, both in general and in the media. So far though your argument has been that Americans are less civically-minded, and your supporting evidence has been a few people you talked to who mentioned movies and watching American infotainment television. This isn't a particularly useful or interesting conversation for me at this point, so I'm going to go back to work. Thanks!