4 ms·

>2. You've purchased free range dairy products Free range or not, cows still need to be artificially inseminated (read: industry term to fancy dress "cow rape"

by adtac 6y ago

>2. You've purchased free range dairy products Free range or not, cows still need to be artificially inseminated (read: industry term to fancy dress "cow rape"), the calves still need to be weaned off after only a few weeks with their mothers (once the colostrum part is over) and/or be given formula milk substitute while humans drink what's rightfully the calf's. Leaving the calf with the cow is absolutely not profitable. Also, the mother cow needs to be culled after only 5-6 years of living because they cannot bear children after that; cows naturally live for up to 20 years. Free range cows still end up in the same slaughter house, so you're indirectly funding the beef industry. Oh, and by the way, if the calf is a male, it's killed right away or sold to the veal industry. It's disgusting and cruel regardless of how much space the cow had to roam in; every other aspect of its life was miserable. Not knowing this is okay, but if you're reading this and the sibling comments, you really have no excuse any more.

thefounder 6y ago
You almost make a religion out of this. Make the lion vegan to complete the circle. That would end the misery on this world, right? Some animals are abused and we can work on regulation to prevent that and promote sustainable development (in EU they already have some laws about this) but I don't think making sure cows die by old age should be the end goal.
- adtac 6y ago
  >Make the lion vegan to complete the circle. 1. Lions are obligate carnivores, we're not. We do not need meat to survive (evidenced by several cultures around the world living off a nearly entirely plant-based diet for centuries), lions do. 2. What animals do isn't a good moral compass. Animals rape each other, steal, kill their children, and do all sorts of morally reprehensible stuff. >Some animals are abused and we can work on regulation to prevent that The best solution to stopping animal abuse is to not breed the animal in the first place. Can't abuse something that doesn't exist now, can we? >I don't think making sure cows die by old age should be the end goal. I never proposed that. I said we shouldn't have bred them into this miserable existence in the first place. Why do we get to decide how long a cow should live? Why do we get to artificially inseminate a cow that cannot possibly give consent? Why do we get to take away the newborn child of a defenceless creature? Come on.
  - realisticeater 6y ago
    How about because I don't care about it that much? Sometimes good food involves suffering. I'm glad we're at the top of the food chain. I'm not about to give up my steak, I'm not about to give up my cheese, I'm certainly not about to give up my foie gras. I don't think we should go out of our way to hurt animals (for example intensive chicken production where you have overcrowded operations where chickens stay in the dark, etc, should be outlawed), but if I want to eat it I'll eat it. The cow need not consent, because it's my food. Fundamentally it's simply not a moral issue to me, it's a gastronomic one. I believe most people agree with me. Vegans are so incredibly out of touch. PETA: People Eating Tasty Animals.
    - adtac 6y ago
      I mean, if you see the footage of what goes on in slaughter houses and then still think momentary sensory pleasure (taste) is more important to you than the life of a sentient being, you're just a sociopath. Do you also believe it is okay for me to torture a dog just because I get visual satisfaction from it? >Vegans are so incredibly out of touch. really? lol ok
      - realisticeater 6y ago
        I'm fully aware of what happens in slaughterhouses. I would be more than willing to pay for more expensive meat where the animals have more space for them, or eat proper grass, as opposed to, let's say, having corn shoved into them and antibiotics to suppress persistent infections, etc. The meat is tastier that way, too. > you're just a sociopath Sure, according to your definition I would be. So would most people, billions of them. > Do you also believe it is okay for me to torture a dog just because I get visual satisfaction from it? Visual satisfaction? No. But if you want to slaughter and eat it I don't have a problem with that. > really? lol ok Yes, really. You come across as some sort of quixotean person yelling at windmills while most of us over here are just eating our meat. It's simply that people don't say it, out of politeness.
    - sweetheart 6y ago
      > Sometimes good food involves suffering It never needs to. You're performing mental gymnastics, I'm sorry. It's never true that this sort of immense suffering just needs to magical occur for the world to operate normally. There are limitless delicious recipes that require 0 suffering, 0 pain, 0 murder. > I don't think we should go out of our way to hurt animals That's what the entirety of animal agriculture is. We go WAAAY out of our way. It's expensive, inefficient, unhealthy, and immoral, and we do it anyway.

by adtac 6y ago

thefounder 6y ago

You almost make a religion out of this. Make the lion vegan to complete the circle. That would end the misery on this world, right? Some animals are abused and we can work on regulation to prevent that and promote sustainable development (in EU they already have some laws about this) but I don't think making sure cows die by old age should be the end goal.

adtac 6y ago
>Make the lion vegan to complete the circle. 1. Lions are obligate carnivores, we're not. We do not need meat to survive (evidenced by several cultures around the world living off a nearly entirely plant-based diet for centuries), lions do. 2. What animals do isn't a good moral compass. Animals rape each other, steal, kill their children, and do all sorts of morally reprehensible stuff. >Some animals are abused and we can work on regulation to prevent that The best solution to stopping animal abuse is to not breed the animal in the first place. Can't abuse something that doesn't exist now, can we? >I don't think making sure cows die by old age should be the end goal. I never proposed that. I said we shouldn't have bred them into this miserable existence in the first place. Why do we get to decide how long a cow should live? Why do we get to artificially inseminate a cow that cannot possibly give consent? Why do we get to take away the newborn child of a defenceless creature? Come on.
- realisticeater 6y ago
  How about because I don't care about it that much? Sometimes good food involves suffering. I'm glad we're at the top of the food chain. I'm not about to give up my steak, I'm not about to give up my cheese, I'm certainly not about to give up my foie gras. I don't think we should go out of our way to hurt animals (for example intensive chicken production where you have overcrowded operations where chickens stay in the dark, etc, should be outlawed), but if I want to eat it I'll eat it. The cow need not consent, because it's my food. Fundamentally it's simply not a moral issue to me, it's a gastronomic one. I believe most people agree with me. Vegans are so incredibly out of touch. PETA: People Eating Tasty Animals.
  - adtac 6y ago
    I mean, if you see the footage of what goes on in slaughter houses and then still think momentary sensory pleasure (taste) is more important to you than the life of a sentient being, you're just a sociopath. Do you also believe it is okay for me to torture a dog just because I get visual satisfaction from it? >Vegans are so incredibly out of touch. really? lol ok
    - realisticeater 6y ago
      I'm fully aware of what happens in slaughterhouses. I would be more than willing to pay for more expensive meat where the animals have more space for them, or eat proper grass, as opposed to, let's say, having corn shoved into them and antibiotics to suppress persistent infections, etc. The meat is tastier that way, too. > you're just a sociopath Sure, according to your definition I would be. So would most people, billions of them. > Do you also believe it is okay for me to torture a dog just because I get visual satisfaction from it? Visual satisfaction? No. But if you want to slaughter and eat it I don't have a problem with that. > really? lol ok Yes, really. You come across as some sort of quixotean person yelling at windmills while most of us over here are just eating our meat. It's simply that people don't say it, out of politeness.
  - sweetheart 6y ago
    > Sometimes good food involves suffering It never needs to. You're performing mental gymnastics, I'm sorry. It's never true that this sort of immense suffering just needs to magical occur for the world to operate normally. There are limitless delicious recipes that require 0 suffering, 0 pain, 0 murder. > I don't think we should go out of our way to hurt animals That's what the entirety of animal agriculture is. We go WAAAY out of our way. It's expensive, inefficient, unhealthy, and immoral, and we do it anyway.