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Trust. Russia and China lie through their teeth on everything and anything. It's irrelevant whether or not they are lying in this particular instance: they cann

Trust. Russia and China lie through their teeth on everything and anything. It's irrelevant whether or not they are lying in this particular instance: they cannot be trusted.

fuoqi 6y ago
As if "the West" and the US in particular don't lie left and right if it helps to promote their agenda. It's a simple matter of who aligns with whom.
- giomasce 6y ago
  Do you really perceive EU/US having the same level of independence of judges, newspapers and regulation bodies as Russia and China? Do you think that minority parties and voices are accepted to the same degree?
- frockington1 6y ago
  Try opening a publishing paper in China that runs #NotMyPresident with a picture of Xi. You may find yourself being re-educated somewhere
- jusssi 6y ago
  "The West" is a bit more restricted in how much they can lie to their own citizens (even with the recent efforts from Mr Trump and Mr Johnson to change that for the worse). Of course, in Mother Russia it is widely believed that everyone lies more or less, and those looking to expose "the truth" generally live dangerously, often with tragic results.
- rimliu 6y ago
  So "the Earth is round" and "the Earth is flat" is a simple matter of who aligns with whom too?
- coryfklein 6y ago
  The difference is that placing trust in China/Russia means trusting in a narrative driven by a small group (the ruling elite), while placing trust in "the West" usually refers to the collective knowledge of scientific endeavours that tend to succeed better in a nation more friendly to liberal democracy.
- andrepd 6y ago
  It's a difference of degree. The US has done (way more than) its fair share of shitty things, no doubt about that. It's still a democratic government (a flawed one) which is miles better than the autocracy of Russia or the oppressive totalitarianism of the CCP.
captain_price7 6y ago
America launched a fake vaccination campaign to catch osama-bin-laden; many villagers in surrounding areas are refusing to take vaccine because they have lost trust. Western governments are no doubt better for their own citizens than say Russia or China, but we outsiders have absolutely no reason to trust one government over the others. Russia's vaccine has only passed phase 2- now that's a good point, "Trust" absolutely isn't.
- ggghhhfff 6y ago
  I wasn’t aware of this. Looked it up and this in fact true. I imagine people from other countries are in fact weary of the US vaccine for this or similar reasons
- nmfisher 6y ago
  I believe the vaccination drive was a cover, not fake - people were still vaccinated as intended. That doesn't necessarily mean it was justified, but I do think it's important to note the difference.
disown 6y ago
Right... And iraq was invaded because of the truth? You think russia and china lie because of propaganda. Their citizens believe we lie because of propaganda. Whether one views another country favorably relies entirely on propaganda.
- captain_price7 6y ago
  Not just Iraq war- Vietnam war (pentagon papers), Wikileaks, Snowden revelations- boggles my mind just how many people still have unflinching trust in their government, specially when a comparison to other countries come in. I don't know if it's nationalism or a hidden desire to feel superior or something else. But given how these western countries handled covid, and the fact that China has a history of fighting viruses like it- I'd rather trust a Chinese vaccine over an American one, all else being equal.

Trust. Russia and China lie through their teeth on everything and anything. It's irrelevant whether or not they are lying in this particular instance: they cannot be trusted.

fuoqi 6y ago

As if "the West" and the US in particular don't lie left and right if it helps to promote their agenda. It's a simple matter of who aligns with whom.

giomasce 6y ago
Do you really perceive EU/US having the same level of independence of judges, newspapers and regulation bodies as Russia and China? Do you think that minority parties and voices are accepted to the same degree?
frockington1 6y ago
Try opening a publishing paper in China that runs #NotMyPresident with a picture of Xi. You may find yourself being re-educated somewhere
jusssi 6y ago
"The West" is a bit more restricted in how much they can lie to their own citizens (even with the recent efforts from Mr Trump and Mr Johnson to change that for the worse). Of course, in Mother Russia it is widely believed that everyone lies more or less, and those looking to expose "the truth" generally live dangerously, often with tragic results.
rimliu 6y ago
So "the Earth is round" and "the Earth is flat" is a simple matter of who aligns with whom too?
coryfklein 6y ago
The difference is that placing trust in China/Russia means trusting in a narrative driven by a small group (the ruling elite), while placing trust in "the West" usually refers to the collective knowledge of scientific endeavours that tend to succeed better in a nation more friendly to liberal democracy.
andrepd 6y ago
It's a difference of degree. The US has done (way more than) its fair share of shitty things, no doubt about that. It's still a democratic government (a flawed one) which is miles better than the autocracy of Russia or the oppressive totalitarianism of the CCP.

captain_price7 6y ago

America launched a fake vaccination campaign to catch osama-bin-laden; many villagers in surrounding areas are refusing to take vaccine because they have lost trust. Western governments are no doubt better for their own citizens than say Russia or China, but we outsiders have absolutely no reason to trust one government over the others. Russia's vaccine has only passed phase 2- now that's a good point, "Trust" absolutely isn't.

ggghhhfff 6y ago
I wasn’t aware of this. Looked it up and this in fact true. I imagine people from other countries are in fact weary of the US vaccine for this or similar reasons
nmfisher 6y ago
I believe the vaccination drive was a cover, not fake - people were still vaccinated as intended. That doesn't necessarily mean it was justified, but I do think it's important to note the difference.

disown 6y ago

Right... And iraq was invaded because of the truth? You think russia and china lie because of propaganda. Their citizens believe we lie because of propaganda. Whether one views another country favorably relies entirely on propaganda.

captain_price7 6y ago
Not just Iraq war- Vietnam war (pentagon papers), Wikileaks, Snowden revelations- boggles my mind just how many people still have unflinching trust in their government, specially when a comparison to other countries come in. I don't know if it's nationalism or a hidden desire to feel superior or something else. But given how these western countries handled covid, and the fact that China has a history of fighting viruses like it- I'd rather trust a Chinese vaccine over an American one, all else being equal.