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OpenDoc was a mid-‘90s Apple software framework that basically did this. It was also adopted by IBM on OS/2 as part of the technology exchange that also resulte

by pavlov 6y ago

OpenDoc was a mid-‘90s Apple software framework that basically did this. It was also adopted by IBM on OS/2 as part of the technology exchange that also resulted in Apple and Motorola using IBM’s POWER CPU architecture. Steve Jobs killed OpenDoc when he returned to Apple in 1997 because it wasn’t NeXT software. The IBM side of the project had already died at that point as Windows 95 trounced OS/2.

ribs 6y ago
Windows 95, with OLE, which became ActiveX, which is pretty isomorphic to OpenDoc.
- TeMPOraL 6y ago
  There's also the wider Component Object Model (COM), which does pretty much everything the author of this article wants, and then some more (e.g. remote objects with network transparency, deep security), and it all works within Windows to this day - but, for some reason, app developers seem to avoid it like fire. I blame COM being a bit annoying to use on developer side, and economic incentives mentioned.
Someone 6y ago
I don’t think he killed it “because it wasn’t NeXT software”. I think he killed it because the market didn’t support it (MS Office showed that an ‘everything but the kitchen sink” solution could conquer the market, leaving only breadcrumbs for smaller parties) and to focus the company.
- TeMPOraL 6y ago
  But MS Office is sort of the implementation of what the article describes, with it being thoroughly COM based. You can embed pieces of Office in your software, or pieces of your software in Office (including saving its state in the MS Office's documents).
  - Someone 6y ago
    Technically, sort of, yes, but sociologically: no. Office doesn’t (seem to) use it itself. If you can insert an Excel table into a Word document, why does Word have table functionality on its own? Why does Excel have its own text box for styled text? Can I embed a Word table inside another document without getting the entire Word editor? An Excel table that’s just a table and not a sheet to which one can add charts, etc? Also (and possibly alongside “we sell Word/Excel separately, too, and want it to be everything but the kitchen sink, to prevent others from providing missing parts”) the answer to that may be “because the UI of OLE-embedded parts isn’t as smooth as it could be”. Outside-in activation (which, reading http://preserve.mactech.com/articles/mactech/Vol.10/10.08/OpenDocvsOLE/index.html http://preserve.mactech.com/articles/mactech/Vol.10/10.08/Op... doesn’t seem to be required with OLE, but I haven’t seen otherwise) means you have to click multiple times to start editing (clock to activate an OLE control, then click to start editing it) OpenDoc promised much more, but of course, the market didn’t want to deliver it at the time, and we also don’t know whether its promises really can be fulfilled (Cyberdog was cute, though)

by pavlov 6y ago

ribs 6y ago

Windows 95, with OLE, which became ActiveX, which is pretty isomorphic to OpenDoc.

TeMPOraL 6y ago
There's also the wider Component Object Model (COM), which does pretty much everything the author of this article wants, and then some more (e.g. remote objects with network transparency, deep security), and it all works within Windows to this day - but, for some reason, app developers seem to avoid it like fire. I blame COM being a bit annoying to use on developer side, and economic incentives mentioned.

Someone 6y ago

I don’t think he killed it “because it wasn’t NeXT software”. I think he killed it because the market didn’t support it (MS Office showed that an ‘everything but the kitchen sink” solution could conquer the market, leaving only breadcrumbs for smaller parties) and to focus the company.

TeMPOraL 6y ago
But MS Office is sort of the implementation of what the article describes, with it being thoroughly COM based. You can embed pieces of Office in your software, or pieces of your software in Office (including saving its state in the MS Office's documents).
- Someone 6y ago
  Technically, sort of, yes, but sociologically: no. Office doesn’t (seem to) use it itself. If you can insert an Excel table into a Word document, why does Word have table functionality on its own? Why does Excel have its own text box for styled text? Can I embed a Word table inside another document without getting the entire Word editor? An Excel table that’s just a table and not a sheet to which one can add charts, etc? Also (and possibly alongside “we sell Word/Excel separately, too, and want it to be everything but the kitchen sink, to prevent others from providing missing parts”) the answer to that may be “because the UI of OLE-embedded parts isn’t as smooth as it could be”. Outside-in activation (which, reading http://preserve.mactech.com/articles/mactech/Vol.10/10.08/OpenDocvsOLE/index.html http://preserve.mactech.com/articles/mactech/Vol.10/10.08/Op... doesn’t seem to be required with OLE, but I haven’t seen otherwise) means you have to click multiple times to start editing (clock to activate an OLE control, then click to start editing it) OpenDoc promised much more, but of course, the market didn’t want to deliver it at the time, and we also don’t know whether its promises really can be fulfilled (Cyberdog was cute, though)