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What I fail to understand, as a foreigner, is how someone can vote for a president who is an outright liar. Look no further than his last tweets as of right now

by jorl17 6y ago

What I fail to understand, as a foreigner, is how someone can vote for a president who is an outright liar. Look no further than his last tweets as of right now. He is denying that he has lost and is insisting that there are illegal things happening (I'm not saying there aren't, but I will go the extra mile and say he has lost it and that only a manchild would say otherwise -- this manchild). I could not go to bed with a clear mind knowing that I voted for a lying disgusting piece of trash, even if that meant that I was voting for the one whose policies I "agreed with the most". I guess I _get_ it if you view politics as sports. Sports fans (in the EU) will support their club to death. The president of a football club can be corrupt and they will still probably back them so that they can back the club. In both cases, these are twisted, unhealthy stances. I really cannot fathom how so many Americans can vote for this piece of trash human being. I don't think all these people are bigots, racists or idiots; I simply cannot understand how someone can be comfortable with having a piece of shit as the face of the country. I used to love America and the idea of going to it. I used to think it was lead by hardworking (albeit maybe _too_ hardworking) people. I used to think that maybe healthcare wasn't "that" important because it was _AMERICA_. I can't think like that anymore because a very significant part of the country chooses to be portrayed by an _objectively and openly racist, sexist bigot_. Heck, I think I'm right leaning on most stuff in life, but I could never ever carry a straight face knowing I contributed to this disaster. I would rather vote blank (I'm a strong believer in doing just that), against the system, than vote "for" a pig so as to not "vote" for the opposition (a typical argument used by trump "non-supporters who vote for him"). At least the opposition wouldn't put America to shame in such a magnitude. In my country America is now used as an example of what not to be, what not to do. We tolerate its undeniable leadership in the world; we no longer worship it or look at it as somewhat of a better society. It used to be the other way around. What happened, America?

presentation 6y ago
US politics is structurally messed up and there will be more escalating drama in the coming years/decades that will definitely leak internationally. With mechanical issues like the electoral college being deeply flawed, to more innate issues of the system like the two party system reducing the entirety of politics in the USA to an adversarial binary, it will just get more polarized and ensure the disenfranchisement of even more people than now. This is a minor win in a sinking ship, IMO.
- pfdietz 6y ago
  The thing that will leak internationally is the rapid and unsustainable increase in the US debt. The political shuffling is just rearranging the deck chairs in comparison.
hindsightbias 6y ago
Nationalism and authoritarianism is a thing. It’s all over the world. Like the surges of salafist movements in the ME every few decades, the same is true in with democracies. The question is whether it is an outlier or the norm. I’m old enough to remember when racism and anti-semitism was common, then not (at least vocally). America is a diverse culture. Why Euros are confused about it, they haven’t studied history. How would a country like the US would turn out as when Puritans, Calvinists, Scots-Irish and whatever other rejects from Europe were sent or fled from their homelands? We got the best and we got the worst.
ImprovedSilence 6y ago
>>. What I fail to understand, as a foreigner, is how someone can vote for a president who is an outright liar. Look no further than his last tweets as of right now. I don't fully understand it myself, but as it's been explained to me by trump supporters is: "don't listen to what he says, look at all the good policy, look at how hard he is on China, look at how many jobs there were pre covid, etc etc". Whether or not you see his policy as good, some people do, and they are willing to overlook his madness because they think he is achieving good things. (actions speak louder than words, etc) Some of his supports do bring up his appointing of tons of federal judges, and this what I would probably consider the most valid reason for voting for him (if one is aligned to a more conservative viewpoint), as his judges are more likely to enforce (or not) the laws that align with "traditional" republican political ideals, and that's the what matters to the voters. Or also because they've always voted R, and Biden= socialism (which is worse than satan worship according to some people's moral codes..), or Biden= Let our cites get burnt down by rioters. This goes back to the, it's easier to vote against someone than for someone. And now that I put this all in words, this second justification is probably what I heard the most during trumps 4 years, some peoples defense of trump always came down to, "but hillary would be way worse". Some level of cognitive dissonance definitely plays into it. Also having some subset of the population support a populist, pathologically lying sociopath is not necessarily a new or uniquely American problem. It's just that the problems seem to be amplified when they are American, cuz everyone is watching.
austincheney 6y ago
> What I fail to understand, as a foreigner, is how someone can vote for a president who is an outright liar. You had two choices of which both were horrid. Which bad choice do you pick and if they are both that bad is the distinction significant?
aww_dang 6y ago
>What I fail to understand, as a foreigner, is how someone can vote for a president who is an outright liar Politicians are liars by definition. It is part of the job description. More people abstained than voted for either candidate.
salawat 6y ago
>What I fail to understand, as a foreigner, is how someone can vote for a president who is an outright liar. American politicians lie through their teeth as a matter of fact. No one gets or delivers anything they campaign on. This is by design. However, I'm still in your camp as well. I can't understand it at all. He didn't get off the first week of his campaign before I was dead refusing to vote for him. However, I couldn't vote for his opponents either, which is where I think a lot of people get caught out, and where I think we have a real weakness in our system. That someone like him even got to that point is a testament that apparently anyone can do it. Just be a bull headed, pathologically lying charlatan and find a way to insert yourself in the nations political apparatus when the time is right.
cutemonster 6y ago
After Trump getting elected once and then somewhat close again, I look at the US as a could be a dictatorship soon country. Someone like Trump but instead being a bring person, could have won the elections I think, and then, via internet surveillance, find the opposition and fabricate charges and put in prison? Combined with maybe forcing FB to show only ads pro one party?
NDizzle 6y ago
As of now, and 2 hours ago (according to the timestamp on your post) Trump is technically correct. The best kind of correct. He hasn't lost. Votes are still being counted in something like 10 states, as ridiculous as that sounds. Contrary to popular belief, the AP doesn't decide who is elected president. Shocking, I know.
- zzleeper 6y ago
  And your point is?
  - NDizzle 6y ago
    My point is... responding, in particular, to the very first line of the post that I replied to.
- longtimegoogler 6y ago
  No he isn't technically correct. He said he has won by a lot, which isn't true.

by jorl17 6y ago

presentation 6y ago

US politics is structurally messed up and there will be more escalating drama in the coming years/decades that will definitely leak internationally. With mechanical issues like the electoral college being deeply flawed, to more innate issues of the system like the two party system reducing the entirety of politics in the USA to an adversarial binary, it will just get more polarized and ensure the disenfranchisement of even more people than now. This is a minor win in a sinking ship, IMO.

pfdietz 6y ago
The thing that will leak internationally is the rapid and unsustainable increase in the US debt. The political shuffling is just rearranging the deck chairs in comparison.

hindsightbias 6y ago

Nationalism and authoritarianism is a thing. It’s all over the world. Like the surges of salafist movements in the ME every few decades, the same is true in with democracies. The question is whether it is an outlier or the norm. I’m old enough to remember when racism and anti-semitism was common, then not (at least vocally). America is a diverse culture. Why Euros are confused about it, they haven’t studied history. How would a country like the US would turn out as when Puritans, Calvinists, Scots-Irish and whatever other rejects from Europe were sent or fled from their homelands? We got the best and we got the worst.

ImprovedSilence 6y ago

>>. What I fail to understand, as a foreigner, is how someone can vote for a president who is an outright liar. Look no further than his last tweets as of right now. I don't fully understand it myself, but as it's been explained to me by trump supporters is: "don't listen to what he says, look at all the good policy, look at how hard he is on China, look at how many jobs there were pre covid, etc etc". Whether or not you see his policy as good, some people do, and they are willing to overlook his madness because they think he is achieving good things. (actions speak louder than words, etc) Some of his supports do bring up his appointing of tons of federal judges, and this what I would probably consider the most valid reason for voting for him (if one is aligned to a more conservative viewpoint), as his judges are more likely to enforce (or not) the laws that align with "traditional" republican political ideals, and that's the what matters to the voters. Or also because they've always voted R, and Biden= socialism (which is worse than satan worship according to some people's moral codes..), or Biden= Let our cites get burnt down by rioters. This goes back to the, it's easier to vote against someone than for someone. And now that I put this all in words, this second justification is probably what I heard the most during trumps 4 years, some peoples defense of trump always came down to, "but hillary would be way worse". Some level of cognitive dissonance definitely plays into it. Also having some subset of the population support a populist, pathologically lying sociopath is not necessarily a new or uniquely American problem. It's just that the problems seem to be amplified when they are American, cuz everyone is watching.

austincheney 6y ago

> What I fail to understand, as a foreigner, is how someone can vote for a president who is an outright liar. You had two choices of which both were horrid. Which bad choice do you pick and if they are both that bad is the distinction significant?

aww_dang 6y ago

>What I fail to understand, as a foreigner, is how someone can vote for a president who is an outright liar Politicians are liars by definition. It is part of the job description. More people abstained than voted for either candidate.

salawat 6y ago

>What I fail to understand, as a foreigner, is how someone can vote for a president who is an outright liar. American politicians lie through their teeth as a matter of fact. No one gets or delivers anything they campaign on. This is by design. However, I'm still in your camp as well. I can't understand it at all. He didn't get off the first week of his campaign before I was dead refusing to vote for him. However, I couldn't vote for his opponents either, which is where I think a lot of people get caught out, and where I think we have a real weakness in our system. That someone like him even got to that point is a testament that apparently anyone can do it. Just be a bull headed, pathologically lying charlatan and find a way to insert yourself in the nations political apparatus when the time is right.

cutemonster 6y ago

After Trump getting elected once and then somewhat close again, I look at the US as a could be a dictatorship soon country. Someone like Trump but instead being a bring person, could have won the elections I think, and then, via internet surveillance, find the opposition and fabricate charges and put in prison? Combined with maybe forcing FB to show only ads pro one party?

NDizzle 6y ago

As of now, and 2 hours ago (according to the timestamp on your post) Trump is technically correct. The best kind of correct. He hasn't lost. Votes are still being counted in something like 10 states, as ridiculous as that sounds. Contrary to popular belief, the AP doesn't decide who is elected president. Shocking, I know.

zzleeper 6y ago
And your point is?
- NDizzle 6y ago
  My point is... responding, in particular, to the very first line of the post that I replied to.
longtimegoogler 6y ago
No he isn't technically correct. He said he has won by a lot, which isn't true.