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> We're actually all rooting for the same things here. It's not helping anything to pretend this is true. For example, consider the spectrum of reactions you w

> We're actually all rooting for the same things here. It's not helping anything to pretend this is true. For example, consider the spectrum of reactions you witness among your peers, not to mention on social media, the next time there's a high profile killing of an unarmed person of color by police officers. I don't think woo, it's great that we all want the same things is the feeling you're going to get.

deleted 6y ago
[deleted]
Latty 6y ago
Indeed. Historically I would have said conservatives in the US wanted the same thing (increased prosperity for all), and just had different ideas on how that was achieved. Under Trump, it has become clear that they (edit: Republicans) want something fundamentally different: to do better than other groups of people. They care more about hurting those they disagree with than making things better for anyone.
- jquery 6y ago
  You were right in the past. The people who want to “drink libtard tears” are a small minority, a mirror image of people on the left who want to throw Republicans into re-education camps. It’s curious how many conclusions people draw from a binary choice on a ballot.
  - donmcronald 6y ago
    > re-education camps Aka schools? Honestly, what do you do with people making $40k / year who think they’re going to be affected by tax on earnings over $400k, going to pay tax on the sale of their primary residence, and going to be affected by the estate tax? There are a lot of people that can’t seem to figure out they aren’t rich and are never going to be.
  - Latty 6y ago
    Except that is a false equivalency, every Republican voter backed a candidate who ran on that platform and policy. Yes, there will always be a few people at the extremes of any movement. It is very different when they control the movement. They may have seen it as the "least-bad" option rather than actively wanting what Trump was offering, but honestly that distinction doesn't matter if they are willing to support that level of harm. You don't get to vote for Trump and claim you aren't in that group. If you enabled him, you own his policy.
  - justin66 6y ago
    Republicans just elected a congressman who addressed the world after the election by saying "Cry more, lib." [1] I question whether Democrats elected anyone advocating sending Republicans to reeducation camps. [1] https://www.citizen-times.com/story/news/local/2020/11/04/cry-more-lib-madison-cawthorn-sounds-childish-out-gate/6165215002/ https://www.citizen-times.com/story/news/local/2020/11/04/cr...
- NateEag 6y ago
  I'm a US citizen, a self-identified conservative, and I cannot stand Trump (or the fact that on average, conservatives voted for him). Not all conservatives fit your described profile.
  - Latty 6y ago
    This is true, I probably should have specified "Republicans" in the second half. Edited.
- donmcronald 6y ago
  Yeah. It seems like a lot of people think they deserve to be filthy rich with a large servant class working for them. The economics of it just don’t work though. It takes a lot of working people to sustain the lifestyle of one rich person.
rbecker 6y ago
Your peers might be wondering why the only killings that become high profile, are those of people of color.
- amykyta 6y ago
  Are you trying to cast doubt on the imbalance in the occurrence of these killings? That seems naive if I assume the best of intentions.
  - rbecker 6y ago
    Could you quantify that imbalance? How many are killed by police, compared to the number of committed homicides (used as proxy for rate of legitimate police interventions), by race?
    - amykyta 6y ago
      I am not going to reply to this because it’s a frustratingly crass response that lives up to the stereotypes of engineers. Is it that hard to believe that even in legitimate police interventions they are much more likely to use deadly force with a black person? “Black men are about 2.5 times more likely to be killed by police over the life course than are white men.” https://www.pnas.org/content/116/34/16793 https://www.pnas.org/content/116/34/16793
      - rbecker 6y ago
        For the benefit of readers less willing to selectively ignore statistics: non-Hispanic whites are 2.4x more likely than blacks to be killed by police (2.7x more if counting only unarmed deaths), per committed homicide. Sources: https://mappingpoliceviolence.org/nationaltrends https://mappingpoliceviolence.org/nationaltrends https://ucr.fbi.gov/crime-in-the-u.s/2018/crime-in-the-u.s.-2018/tables/expanded-homicide-data-table-6.xls https://ucr.fbi.gov/crime-in-the-u.s/2018/crime-in-the-u.s.-...
- justin66 6y ago
  That was just an example of a controversial topic. I mentioned a spectrum of opinions that were observable amongst peers and on social media, and that is certainly one. (The premises are false enough that it feels less like a "peers" opinion and more like a "social media rando who needs attention" opinion, but I guess that distinction illustrates the original point.)
austincheney 6y ago
I guess it’s true, at least from many of these comments, that many people really want division. They seem to need division to qualify what are otherwise extreme or unbalanced opinions. That sort of division seems to have cost one party the White House and the other a lot of seats in Congress.
- justin66 6y ago
  I have no idea what you mean. "Division" (whatever that means) seems to be something you care about, based on your other comments, but I have literally no idea what you're driving at.

deleted 6y ago

[deleted]

Latty 6y ago

Indeed. Historically I would have said conservatives in the US wanted the same thing (increased prosperity for all), and just had different ideas on how that was achieved. Under Trump, it has become clear that they (edit: Republicans) want something fundamentally different: to do better than other groups of people. They care more about hurting those they disagree with than making things better for anyone.

jquery 6y ago
You were right in the past. The people who want to “drink libtard tears” are a small minority, a mirror image of people on the left who want to throw Republicans into re-education camps. It’s curious how many conclusions people draw from a binary choice on a ballot.
- donmcronald 6y ago
  > re-education camps Aka schools? Honestly, what do you do with people making $40k / year who think they’re going to be affected by tax on earnings over $400k, going to pay tax on the sale of their primary residence, and going to be affected by the estate tax? There are a lot of people that can’t seem to figure out they aren’t rich and are never going to be.
- Latty 6y ago
  Except that is a false equivalency, every Republican voter backed a candidate who ran on that platform and policy. Yes, there will always be a few people at the extremes of any movement. It is very different when they control the movement. They may have seen it as the "least-bad" option rather than actively wanting what Trump was offering, but honestly that distinction doesn't matter if they are willing to support that level of harm. You don't get to vote for Trump and claim you aren't in that group. If you enabled him, you own his policy.
- justin66 6y ago
  Republicans just elected a congressman who addressed the world after the election by saying "Cry more, lib." [1] I question whether Democrats elected anyone advocating sending Republicans to reeducation camps. [1] https://www.citizen-times.com/story/news/local/2020/11/04/cry-more-lib-madison-cawthorn-sounds-childish-out-gate/6165215002/ https://www.citizen-times.com/story/news/local/2020/11/04/cr...
NateEag 6y ago
I'm a US citizen, a self-identified conservative, and I cannot stand Trump (or the fact that on average, conservatives voted for him). Not all conservatives fit your described profile.
- Latty 6y ago
  This is true, I probably should have specified "Republicans" in the second half. Edited.
donmcronald 6y ago
Yeah. It seems like a lot of people think they deserve to be filthy rich with a large servant class working for them. The economics of it just don’t work though. It takes a lot of working people to sustain the lifestyle of one rich person.

rbecker 6y ago

Your peers might be wondering why the only killings that become high profile, are those of people of color.

amykyta 6y ago
Are you trying to cast doubt on the imbalance in the occurrence of these killings? That seems naive if I assume the best of intentions.
- rbecker 6y ago
  Could you quantify that imbalance? How many are killed by police, compared to the number of committed homicides (used as proxy for rate of legitimate police interventions), by race?
  - amykyta 6y ago
    I am not going to reply to this because it’s a frustratingly crass response that lives up to the stereotypes of engineers. Is it that hard to believe that even in legitimate police interventions they are much more likely to use deadly force with a black person? “Black men are about 2.5 times more likely to be killed by police over the life course than are white men.” https://www.pnas.org/content/116/34/16793 https://www.pnas.org/content/116/34/16793
    - rbecker 6y ago
      For the benefit of readers less willing to selectively ignore statistics: non-Hispanic whites are 2.4x more likely than blacks to be killed by police (2.7x more if counting only unarmed deaths), per committed homicide. Sources: https://mappingpoliceviolence.org/nationaltrends https://mappingpoliceviolence.org/nationaltrends https://ucr.fbi.gov/crime-in-the-u.s/2018/crime-in-the-u.s.-2018/tables/expanded-homicide-data-table-6.xls https://ucr.fbi.gov/crime-in-the-u.s/2018/crime-in-the-u.s.-...
justin66 6y ago
That was just an example of a controversial topic. I mentioned a spectrum of opinions that were observable amongst peers and on social media, and that is certainly one. (The premises are false enough that it feels less like a "peers" opinion and more like a "social media rando who needs attention" opinion, but I guess that distinction illustrates the original point.)

austincheney 6y ago

I guess it’s true, at least from many of these comments, that many people really want division. They seem to need division to qualify what are otherwise extreme or unbalanced opinions. That sort of division seems to have cost one party the White House and the other a lot of seats in Congress.

justin66 6y ago
I have no idea what you mean. "Division" (whatever that means) seems to be something you care about, based on your other comments, but I have literally no idea what you're driving at.