5 ms·

If you work for Apple, we need your help...

43 points by st3fan 18y ago

tlrobinson 18y ago
It's quite silly that Apple still has the SDK under NDA. How do they expect developers to share tips and tricks to improve their applications?
- petercooper 18y ago
  It's also quite silly they have the apps wrapped up with DRM when Steve Jobs seems keen on avoiding DRM in other areas - http://www.apple.com/hotnews/thoughtsonmusic/ http://www.apple.com/hotnews/thoughtsonmusic/ - but, hey, this is Apple, and it's a closed platform. In any case, while the SDK is under NDA, it does mention that you can discuss it with other developers within the same program.. it's just discussion with the outside world that's the problem.
deleted 18y ago
[deleted]
icky 18y ago
Every time I forget about Tim Bray's sharecropper essay, Apple reminds me of it again.
- sebg 18y ago
  Link to Tim Bray's essay ( I think) => http://www.tbray.org/ongoing/When/200x/2003/07/12/WebsThePlace http://www.tbray.org/ongoing/When/200x/2003/07/12/WebsThePla...
gcv 18y ago
Most likely, this is just plain corporate bureaucracy. Of course Apple wants people to write programs for the iPhone. Of course Apple wants people to write books about the iPhone. However, Apple is a big company, and big companies specialize in being slow. If the senior person responsible for the iPhone SDK forgot to call the legal department and tell it to relax the restrictions, it probably didn't occur to legal to take the initiative.
- silencio 18y ago
  Given all the developers I see bitching about this restriction (almost every iPhone one I know/know of, especially high profile ones..like apple design award winners (craig hockenberry of twitterrific fame)), I'd be surprised if everyone just forgot about that wee little detail. :) I was flabbergasted to see the NDA restriction still applying after the final SDK was released (http://lists.apple.com/archives/cocoa-dev/2008/Jul/msg00855.html http://lists.apple.com/archives/cocoa-dev/2008/Jul/msg00855....) and since Apple is still pretty keen about the NDA, I have a feeling it's not that :)
jrockway 18y ago
Frankly, I would just ignore the agreement. It's easier to beg for forgiveness than to ask for permission. Also, <insert usual remark about the unenforceability of "I Agree" contracts>
- thomasswift 18y ago
  Normally, I'd agree with you but this apple, they'd have their lawyers all over this.
- jon_dahl 18y ago
  Works for an individual, but more tricky for a publisher.
- gm 18y ago
  I'd be careful in telling people EULAs are not enforceable. Case law is all over the map on this: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/EULA#Enforceability http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/EULA#Enforceability
sktrdie 18y ago
"at last count, I have 8 Macs in my home". Why do you need 8 computers?
- andreyf 18y ago
  He was probably counting old laptops, iPhones, and maybe iPods?
- a-priori 18y ago
  Keep in mind he probably has kids, and they each probably have a Mac.
- petercooper 18y ago
  I have 8 Macs also. Whenever I upgrade, I have one more. No-one will buy my old ones at the price I want to sell, or either I want to keep them around as spares. That number should go down over time though. Apple's lost me as a customer over this whole iPhone mess. Back to the PC I go if I can sell this Mac Pro (but I'll always keep an iMac ;-)) - as an aside, if anyone in the UK fancies buying an early 2008 Mac Pro with 30" ACD, I'm all ears.
  - trenchfever 18y ago
    Of course you could also choose to donate one to broke ass students. For example someone like me. :-P Who knows, maybe I can even work for you when I graduate. :grin:
Tichy 18y ago
You just have to learn to trust...

43 points by st3fan 18y ago

It's quite silly that Apple still has the SDK under NDA. How do they expect developers to share tips and tricks to improve their applications?

petercooper 18y ago
It's also quite silly they have the apps wrapped up with DRM when Steve Jobs seems keen on avoiding DRM in other areas - http://www.apple.com/hotnews/thoughtsonmusic/ http://www.apple.com/hotnews/thoughtsonmusic/ - but, hey, this is Apple, and it's a closed platform. In any case, while the SDK is under NDA, it does mention that you can discuss it with other developers within the same program.. it's just discussion with the outside world that's the problem.

deleted 18y ago

[deleted]

icky 18y ago

Every time I forget about Tim Bray's sharecropper essay, Apple reminds me of it again.

sebg 18y ago
Link to Tim Bray's essay ( I think) => http://www.tbray.org/ongoing/When/200x/2003/07/12/WebsThePlace http://www.tbray.org/ongoing/When/200x/2003/07/12/WebsThePla...

gcv 18y ago

Most likely, this is just plain corporate bureaucracy. Of course Apple wants people to write programs for the iPhone. Of course Apple wants people to write books about the iPhone. However, Apple is a big company, and big companies specialize in being slow. If the senior person responsible for the iPhone SDK forgot to call the legal department and tell it to relax the restrictions, it probably didn't occur to legal to take the initiative.

silencio 18y ago
Given all the developers I see bitching about this restriction (almost every iPhone one I know/know of, especially high profile ones..like apple design award winners (craig hockenberry of twitterrific fame)), I'd be surprised if everyone just forgot about that wee little detail. :) I was flabbergasted to see the NDA restriction still applying after the final SDK was released (http://lists.apple.com/archives/cocoa-dev/2008/Jul/msg00855.html http://lists.apple.com/archives/cocoa-dev/2008/Jul/msg00855....) and since Apple is still pretty keen about the NDA, I have a feeling it's not that :)

jrockway 18y ago

Frankly, I would just ignore the agreement. It's easier to beg for forgiveness than to ask for permission. Also, <insert usual remark about the unenforceability of "I Agree" contracts>

thomasswift 18y ago
Normally, I'd agree with you but this apple, they'd have their lawyers all over this.
jon_dahl 18y ago
Works for an individual, but more tricky for a publisher.
gm 18y ago
I'd be careful in telling people EULAs are not enforceable. Case law is all over the map on this: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/EULA#Enforceability http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/EULA#Enforceability

sktrdie 18y ago

"at last count, I have 8 Macs in my home". Why do you need 8 computers?

andreyf 18y ago
He was probably counting old laptops, iPhones, and maybe iPods?
a-priori 18y ago
Keep in mind he probably has kids, and they each probably have a Mac.
petercooper 18y ago
I have 8 Macs also. Whenever I upgrade, I have one more. No-one will buy my old ones at the price I want to sell, or either I want to keep them around as spares. That number should go down over time though. Apple's lost me as a customer over this whole iPhone mess. Back to the PC I go if I can sell this Mac Pro (but I'll always keep an iMac ;-)) - as an aside, if anyone in the UK fancies buying an early 2008 Mac Pro with 30" ACD, I'm all ears.
- trenchfever 18y ago
  Of course you could also choose to donate one to broke ass students. For example someone like me. :-P Who knows, maybe I can even work for you when I graduate. :grin:

Tichy 18y ago

You just have to learn to trust...