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Bertrand Russell (obiviously) lived before social media, but he saw what the information age was doing to people. He didn't put it this way, but with enough inf

Bertrand Russell (obiviously) lived before social media, but he saw what the information age was doing to people. He didn't put it this way, but with enough information you can see your place on the bell curve. Now most people realize they are average, and not extraordinary at all. Even really smart people are still pretty close to the middle. Russell puts it better, of course: http://bactra.org/Russell/on_youthful_cynicism.html http://bactra.org/Russell/on_youthful_cynicism.html "Moreover many kinds of beauty require that a man should take himself more seriously than is possible for an intelligent modern. A prominent citizen in a small city State, such as Athens or Florence, could without difficulty feel himself important. The earth was the center of the Universe, man was the purpose of creation, his own city showed man at his best, and he himself was among the best of his own city. In such circumstances Æschylus or Dante could take his own joys or sorrows seriously. He could feel that the emotions of the individual matter, and that tragic occurrences deserve to be celebrated in immortal verse. But the modern man, when misfortune assails him, is conscious of himself as a unit in a statistical total; the past and the future stretch before him in a dreary procession of trivial defeats. Man himself appears as a somewhat ridiculous strutting animal, shouting and fussing during a brief interlude between infinite silences." Any certainly, man's place in the bell curve is not the only problem here, but it is a prominent one, and one that existed before social media, and is almost certainly aggravated by the other problems of social media.

bagacrap 6y ago
I don't understand. Athens man didn't understand he was going to die and be forgotten? Only modern man is aware that life is a "brief interlude"? (Not that I think everyone would agree with the infinite silence part.)
- everdrive 6y ago
  Senior (1), I can see your point. The stoics who lived well before Russell certainly did not put a lot of value in the emotions of the person. I'm paraphrasing quite badly here, but Marcus Aurelius said something to the effect of "everything that will happen has already happened, there is nothing special about me, and it's natural for me to die and be forgotten." I think Russell still paints a valid point, however you're right to think that perspectives were not uniform in the past, nor are they uniform now. I do believe, however, statistical awareness does add a bit more weight to Russell's perspective. (1) https://youtu.be/ZISMQ9O3EDQ?t=108 https://youtu.be/ZISMQ9O3EDQ?t=108
  - anonymouse008 6y ago
    I also don't think Russell was speaking to stoics, but the local, or regional, experts. There's a common saying, "why be a big fish in a small pond?" It's used mostly to critique an idea that you should reach for something more - competing in a bigger city or bigger stage to better yourself. Now, the 'pond' is no longer tied to where you live - it follows you everyday on YouTube, Twitter, Blogs, everywhere. As I think is argued by Russell and everdrive, the pond has become the full connected world and 'opting out' is hard to do... making the regional experts that provide beauty to smaller communities inferior to the common man who sees greatness on the inter webs scrolling through ads. What's probably worse, I imagine this connection has removed a few potential regional experts drive to spend the hard time working and learning. I fear many of these people could have become one of the real 'greats' - had they retained the little glimmer of 'unfounded confidence' that is washed away with the constant stimulus of other greats. Finally, I'm not saying all is lost... some thrive in this and view stimuli of the greats as inspirational... but it's definitely not the same skillset that previous generations used to thrive.
    - angst_ridden 6y ago
      I agree. It's an observation on the great flattening. When I was a kid, the neighbor who knew something about Ham radio was a brilliant expert, the neighbor who made bread was an exceptional baker, and the guy down the street who could paint portraits was a talented artist. Now, compared to all the talents in the world, they were all just competent at best, or even mediocre. In those days, the comparison wasn't visible. Now it's in everyone's face 24x7. It doesn't mean you can't enjoy the activities. But if you're vested in being the best or even notable, you're now competing on a global scale rather than just your town.
      - anonymouse008 6y ago
        And therein lies the crux of the issue: > It doesn’t mean you can’t enjoy the activities. But if you’re vested in being the best or even notable, you’re now competing on a global scale rather than just your town. So true, and all this becomes sinister when you begin to realize that ‘enjoyment’ comes in many flavors - and lot of enjoyment comes from sharing with others. So when other people say (not you I don’t think), “well you can do X just for the love of doing X,” they miss out on is the response, ‘well yeah, but I want to share it with you, too!’
T-hawk 6y ago
This is it. The social media depression effect is that you're always comparing yourself to the top of the bell curve rather than the middle. Suppose you have 52 friends who all go on vacation one week out of the year. Every week you will compare yourself to whichever one who is posting their fabulous vacation photos. This doesn't mean you're having a worse life or missing out, you're completely average. You just only notice the 51 comparisons in that direction and don't notice the 51 comparisons during your own vacation week.
- atleta 6y ago
  Interestingly, I never had this feeling. My reaction was always like: oh, cool, this guy's there, that gal is doing this thing. Or maybe "well, that's a good idea, I'll try it go/there one day." Maybe because I was aware of what you are saying, that everyone shares their best experiences and moments, and even those in an inflated way and on top of this, FB will find those and make those posts more popular (because people will react to them more strongly). Though thinking about it, I never had this feeling when I've learned about this IRL while I knew some people actually can get envy (i.e. feel bad) when they hear others are doing good or have fun even if they were 100% OK with their situation before hearing that.
  - valarauko 6y ago
    I suppose my response to these kind of posts falls somewhere in the middle. Looking at somebody's vacation pictures doesn't make me specifically jealous to them, but it adds to the generalized malaise of being at the tail end of the bell curve. Sure, intellectually you realize you're probably average, but I think it erodes away at your subconscious.
deleted 6y ago
[deleted]

bagacrap 6y ago

I don't understand. Athens man didn't understand he was going to die and be forgotten? Only modern man is aware that life is a "brief interlude"? (Not that I think everyone would agree with the infinite silence part.)

everdrive 6y ago
Senior (1), I can see your point. The stoics who lived well before Russell certainly did not put a lot of value in the emotions of the person. I'm paraphrasing quite badly here, but Marcus Aurelius said something to the effect of "everything that will happen has already happened, there is nothing special about me, and it's natural for me to die and be forgotten." I think Russell still paints a valid point, however you're right to think that perspectives were not uniform in the past, nor are they uniform now. I do believe, however, statistical awareness does add a bit more weight to Russell's perspective. (1) https://youtu.be/ZISMQ9O3EDQ?t=108 https://youtu.be/ZISMQ9O3EDQ?t=108
- anonymouse008 6y ago
  I also don't think Russell was speaking to stoics, but the local, or regional, experts. There's a common saying, "why be a big fish in a small pond?" It's used mostly to critique an idea that you should reach for something more - competing in a bigger city or bigger stage to better yourself. Now, the 'pond' is no longer tied to where you live - it follows you everyday on YouTube, Twitter, Blogs, everywhere. As I think is argued by Russell and everdrive, the pond has become the full connected world and 'opting out' is hard to do... making the regional experts that provide beauty to smaller communities inferior to the common man who sees greatness on the inter webs scrolling through ads. What's probably worse, I imagine this connection has removed a few potential regional experts drive to spend the hard time working and learning. I fear many of these people could have become one of the real 'greats' - had they retained the little glimmer of 'unfounded confidence' that is washed away with the constant stimulus of other greats. Finally, I'm not saying all is lost... some thrive in this and view stimuli of the greats as inspirational... but it's definitely not the same skillset that previous generations used to thrive.
  - angst_ridden 6y ago
    I agree. It's an observation on the great flattening. When I was a kid, the neighbor who knew something about Ham radio was a brilliant expert, the neighbor who made bread was an exceptional baker, and the guy down the street who could paint portraits was a talented artist. Now, compared to all the talents in the world, they were all just competent at best, or even mediocre. In those days, the comparison wasn't visible. Now it's in everyone's face 24x7. It doesn't mean you can't enjoy the activities. But if you're vested in being the best or even notable, you're now competing on a global scale rather than just your town.
    - anonymouse008 6y ago
      And therein lies the crux of the issue: > It doesn’t mean you can’t enjoy the activities. But if you’re vested in being the best or even notable, you’re now competing on a global scale rather than just your town. So true, and all this becomes sinister when you begin to realize that ‘enjoyment’ comes in many flavors - and lot of enjoyment comes from sharing with others. So when other people say (not you I don’t think), “well you can do X just for the love of doing X,” they miss out on is the response, ‘well yeah, but I want to share it with you, too!’

T-hawk 6y ago

This is it. The social media depression effect is that you're always comparing yourself to the top of the bell curve rather than the middle. Suppose you have 52 friends who all go on vacation one week out of the year. Every week you will compare yourself to whichever one who is posting their fabulous vacation photos. This doesn't mean you're having a worse life or missing out, you're completely average. You just only notice the 51 comparisons in that direction and don't notice the 51 comparisons during your own vacation week.

atleta 6y ago
Interestingly, I never had this feeling. My reaction was always like: oh, cool, this guy's there, that gal is doing this thing. Or maybe "well, that's a good idea, I'll try it go/there one day." Maybe because I was aware of what you are saying, that everyone shares their best experiences and moments, and even those in an inflated way and on top of this, FB will find those and make those posts more popular (because people will react to them more strongly). Though thinking about it, I never had this feeling when I've learned about this IRL while I knew some people actually can get envy (i.e. feel bad) when they hear others are doing good or have fun even if they were 100% OK with their situation before hearing that.
- valarauko 6y ago
  I suppose my response to these kind of posts falls somewhere in the middle. Looking at somebody's vacation pictures doesn't make me specifically jealous to them, but it adds to the generalized malaise of being at the tail end of the bell curve. Sure, intellectually you realize you're probably average, but I think it erodes away at your subconscious.

deleted 6y ago

[deleted]