11 ms·

Well, that problem is solved, but there are new ones. Once no one needs minks for coats, they just wipe them out as nuisances, making them endangered or extinc

Well, that problem is solved, but there are new ones. Once no one needs minks for coats, they just wipe them out as nuisances, making them endangered or extinct. As it is, I believe the mink has been eradicated from many parts of the world. Now, we may not need mink. But at least making coats from them mean they will be around.

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foogazi 6y ago
> But at least making coats from them mean they will be around. Being around means nothing to the individual minks being caged and slaughtered
- jfk13 6y ago
  "Being around" as a farmed animal may bear little relation to being around as a free, wild creature. Given a few generations, we tend to turn the animals we farm into a parody of the original creature. How well would the average battery chicken survive if it were set free?
  - deleted 6y ago
    [deleted]
  - rapnie 6y ago
    > How well would the average battery chicken survive if it were set free? This was tested in a Dutch TV program some years ago ("Keuringsdienst van waarde") where they got some newborn battery chickens and placed them on a regular farm, amongst healthy free-roaming chickens. They got the same food, but still 'exploded' in size until they couldn't walk. Their feathers look awful. On the whole they looked sick and miserable. Just like battery chickens, actually
- deleted 6y ago
  [deleted]
- romanoderoma 6y ago
  Dennet wrote a lot about animal perceptions and self consciousness It's hard to tell if the life they live makes some difference for the individual It's hard for us humans to fathom it, but is it for them? We still don't know for sure. https://lafavephilosophy.x10host.com/dennett_anim_csness.html https://lafavephilosophy.x10host.com/dennett_anim_csness.htm...
  - ornornor 6y ago
    If in doubt, why not err on the side of caution and just not inflict animals this existence, just in case they might care?
    - notreallytrue 6y ago
      We are not doing it though What do you do if a snake or a cockroach appears in your house? What happens if a bear wants to share the same living space you live in? I understand your position, but the simple fact that we live in a modern World and we are at the top of it "inflicts animals this existence" I like to not do it on purpose and I don't own a fur, if that's what you are curious about, but I'm not lying to myself believing that mink farming is worse than living in big cities that pollute the environment irreparably Am I being cautious enough? I don't think so...
      - ornornor 6y ago
        We’re talking about farming animals and killing them for food or fur here. I personally go out of my way to not kill anything. I catch bugs and throw them outside. I move frogs and snails off the road when I get the chance so people or cars don’t step on them. I’ve never faced a bear yet though. But that’s a bit extreme. How many people face bears? It’s not a competition, because something is worse than something else or not doesn’t mean we should keep doing it. Farming animals is unnecessary in the vast majority of cases so why not stop doing it? Same with cities and pollution, it’s not all or nothing. There are more and less damaging ways of building, ways that are a bit less obnoxious than the way we’ve mostly been doing it for the last couple of centuries.

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foogazi 6y ago

> But at least making coats from them mean they will be around. Being around means nothing to the individual minks being caged and slaughtered

jfk13 6y ago
"Being around" as a farmed animal may bear little relation to being around as a free, wild creature. Given a few generations, we tend to turn the animals we farm into a parody of the original creature. How well would the average battery chicken survive if it were set free?
- deleted 6y ago
  [deleted]
- rapnie 6y ago
  > How well would the average battery chicken survive if it were set free? This was tested in a Dutch TV program some years ago ("Keuringsdienst van waarde") where they got some newborn battery chickens and placed them on a regular farm, amongst healthy free-roaming chickens. They got the same food, but still 'exploded' in size until they couldn't walk. Their feathers look awful. On the whole they looked sick and miserable. Just like battery chickens, actually
deleted 6y ago
[deleted]
romanoderoma 6y ago
Dennet wrote a lot about animal perceptions and self consciousness It's hard to tell if the life they live makes some difference for the individual It's hard for us humans to fathom it, but is it for them? We still don't know for sure. https://lafavephilosophy.x10host.com/dennett_anim_csness.html https://lafavephilosophy.x10host.com/dennett_anim_csness.htm...
- ornornor 6y ago
  If in doubt, why not err on the side of caution and just not inflict animals this existence, just in case they might care?
  - notreallytrue 6y ago
    We are not doing it though What do you do if a snake or a cockroach appears in your house? What happens if a bear wants to share the same living space you live in? I understand your position, but the simple fact that we live in a modern World and we are at the top of it "inflicts animals this existence" I like to not do it on purpose and I don't own a fur, if that's what you are curious about, but I'm not lying to myself believing that mink farming is worse than living in big cities that pollute the environment irreparably Am I being cautious enough? I don't think so...
    - ornornor 6y ago
      We’re talking about farming animals and killing them for food or fur here. I personally go out of my way to not kill anything. I catch bugs and throw them outside. I move frogs and snails off the road when I get the chance so people or cars don’t step on them. I’ve never faced a bear yet though. But that’s a bit extreme. How many people face bears? It’s not a competition, because something is worse than something else or not doesn’t mean we should keep doing it. Farming animals is unnecessary in the vast majority of cases so why not stop doing it? Same with cities and pollution, it’s not all or nothing. There are more and less damaging ways of building, ways that are a bit less obnoxious than the way we’ve mostly been doing it for the last couple of centuries.