3 ms·

> How would a summary offense with a punishment of education on rehab options create more crime? I'm not sure if I'm mis-understanding you or if you aren't fam

> How would a summary offense with a punishment of education on rehab options create more crime? I'm not sure if I'm mis-understanding you or if you aren't familiar with the legislation in question. What you suggest here seems an awful lot like a marginally more sever version of what this law does.

giantg2 6y ago
It does seem very similar. It's a little different. The new law imposes a fine of $100 and appears to be a civil citation. I was suggesting it be a summary offense with no fine and education of the rehab option available. The main difference is in secondary impacts. The civil citation may not show up on a background check, which may not prevent the person from purchasing weapons. Any criminal conviction (even just a summary offense) related to drugs would prevent the purchase of weapons.
- ogre_codes 6y ago
  Anything you get sited for would be on your record similar to the way your traffic tickets are. If they are going to revise gun legislation to limit sales of guns to specific types of violations, there are a lot of other violations I think should be higher up on the list. Not against the idea of this, but IMO any decisions about fire-arms ownership limits should be a separate issue, not part of how they legislate drug possession.
  - giantg2 6y ago
    The issue is that if you challenge a civil matter in court, the jury doesn't have to be unanimous in the decision of your guilt, and you generally don't have the same protections/procedures in place at a civil trial. The the drug conviction restriction is already a federal restriction. So you could have people "convicted" of a civil offense by a split jury who would end up losing their rights. That's assuming the the feds consider a civil judgement the same as a criminal conviction on this matter. Even without the conviction, I believe the federal form requires a purchaser to attest to not using a controlled substance, which the civil judgement would indicate one has used. I think criminal background checks only show criminal citations. Civil actions generally shouldn't show. Traffic citations are generally treated as criminal offenses (summary offense), but maybe some states are different.

giantg2 6y ago

It does seem very similar. It's a little different. The new law imposes a fine of $100 and appears to be a civil citation. I was suggesting it be a summary offense with no fine and education of the rehab option available. The main difference is in secondary impacts. The civil citation may not show up on a background check, which may not prevent the person from purchasing weapons. Any criminal conviction (even just a summary offense) related to drugs would prevent the purchase of weapons.

ogre_codes 6y ago
Anything you get sited for would be on your record similar to the way your traffic tickets are. If they are going to revise gun legislation to limit sales of guns to specific types of violations, there are a lot of other violations I think should be higher up on the list. Not against the idea of this, but IMO any decisions about fire-arms ownership limits should be a separate issue, not part of how they legislate drug possession.
- giantg2 6y ago
  The issue is that if you challenge a civil matter in court, the jury doesn't have to be unanimous in the decision of your guilt, and you generally don't have the same protections/procedures in place at a civil trial. The the drug conviction restriction is already a federal restriction. So you could have people "convicted" of a civil offense by a split jury who would end up losing their rights. That's assuming the the feds consider a civil judgement the same as a criminal conviction on this matter. Even without the conviction, I believe the federal form requires a purchaser to attest to not using a controlled substance, which the civil judgement would indicate one has used. I think criminal background checks only show criminal citations. Civil actions generally shouldn't show. Traffic citations are generally treated as criminal offenses (summary offense), but maybe some states are different.