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Even third world countries like Mexico are able to give reliable preliminary statistics the same night, and definitive statistics in a couple of days. I'd call

Even third world countries like Mexico are able to give reliable preliminary statistics the same night, and definitive statistics in a couple of days. I'd call it a disgrace that the self-proclaimed bastion of democracy could legally delay results for most of this month. It can be poor organization or regulation, but even if it's done for a good reason, it erodes the credibility of your elections.

tgb 6y ago
There's nothing more degrading to the credibility of the elections than the people running around pretending that suddenly counting votes quickly (rather than accurately) is the important thing.
- ASalazarMX 6y ago
  The thing is, you can have both, there's no sensible reason to delay results, and it might give the appearance of wiggle room. If the count was more efficient, Trump wouldn't have time to try tactics like suing Michigan to stop counting. Let me repeat that: you can have quick and accurate elections, and your current process gives others the impression that it has margin for under-the-table negotiation.
  - tgb 6y ago
    Or we can educate people accurately about the elections so that there is no concern over a normal and above-board process proceeding as expected instead of spreading FUD. That's the real "we can have it both ways."
    - ASalazarMX 6y ago
      Your solution is to educate every single citizen on the flaws of the process, instead of optimizing the process? That’s like Steve Jobs telling people they were holding their phone wrong.
      - tgb 6y ago
        My immediate solution is to stop actively miseducating the populace.
        ASalazarMX 6y ago
        Your immediate solution has been waiting decades for a better, permanent solution. As Trump has sued and contested Nevada, Wisconsin, Georgia, Pennsylvania and Michigan, this election might become even more protracted than usual. I know right now it's all you have, and it sucks. It has somehow worked because the candidates have been polite, but it was only a matter of time before you got a shameless candidate trying to exploit every possible loophole to stay in power. Telling people your electoral system is flawed and it must be dragged screaming into the 21st century is not miseducation. Your electoral college doesn't reflect the will of your citizens.
        tgb 6y ago
        Electoral College is completely unrelated. Court battles happen even after votes are counted, so are unrelated too. Results aren't certified until December anyway.

tgb 6y ago

There's nothing more degrading to the credibility of the elections than the people running around pretending that suddenly counting votes quickly (rather than accurately) is the important thing.

ASalazarMX 6y ago
The thing is, you can have both, there's no sensible reason to delay results, and it might give the appearance of wiggle room. If the count was more efficient, Trump wouldn't have time to try tactics like suing Michigan to stop counting. Let me repeat that: you can have quick and accurate elections, and your current process gives others the impression that it has margin for under-the-table negotiation.
- tgb 6y ago
  Or we can educate people accurately about the elections so that there is no concern over a normal and above-board process proceeding as expected instead of spreading FUD. That's the real "we can have it both ways."
  - ASalazarMX 6y ago
    Your solution is to educate every single citizen on the flaws of the process, instead of optimizing the process? That’s like Steve Jobs telling people they were holding their phone wrong.
    - tgb 6y ago
      My immediate solution is to stop actively miseducating the populace.
      - ASalazarMX 6y ago
        Your immediate solution has been waiting decades for a better, permanent solution. As Trump has sued and contested Nevada, Wisconsin, Georgia, Pennsylvania and Michigan, this election might become even more protracted than usual. I know right now it's all you have, and it sucks. It has somehow worked because the candidates have been polite, but it was only a matter of time before you got a shameless candidate trying to exploit every possible loophole to stay in power. Telling people your electoral system is flawed and it must be dragged screaming into the 21st century is not miseducation. Your electoral college doesn't reflect the will of your citizens.
        tgb 6y ago
        Electoral College is completely unrelated. Court battles happen even after votes are counted, so are unrelated too. Results aren't certified until December anyway.