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It's noteworthy that a relatively modern protocol like ADS-B (and Mode S transponders) has completely no regard for information security. It would have been ver

It's noteworthy that a relatively modern protocol like ADS-B (and Mode S transponders) has completely no regard for information security. It would have been very easy to generate a random address on startup and assign a correlation code only known to ATC in the clearance. Like the original 4 digit mode C codes were not identifiable. That wouldn't stop any traffic collision or ATC function from working but would prevent persistent tracking of for example private jets.

wrkronmiller 6y ago
> That wouldn't stop any traffic collision or ATC function from working but would prevent persistent tracking of for example private jets. I'm not sure how well that would work w/r/t ATC hand-off and their ability to look up flight plans. Furthermore, there's the problem of getting the random ID to ATC after the plane has "started up."
- jjwiseman 6y ago
  They're already doing this, but there's no reason for it to be a random ID—It's an ephemeral ID assigned by the FAA. So you know your ephemeral ID & registration, the FAA knows your ephemeral ID & registration, and while everyone else can see your ephemeral ID they do not know the aircraft registration it's tied to. https://www.faa.gov/nextgen/equipadsb/privacy/ https://www.faa.gov/nextgen/equipadsb/privacy/
  - kortilla 6y ago
    An interesting image recognition project would be a camera watching departures from an airport that records the tail number of a plane and correlates it with the ephemeral ID to feed back into the exchange.
mike_d 6y ago
> would prevent persistent tracking of for example private jets Why? They are using our airspace. Looking down in to our backyards. I have a right to at least get an identifier I can use to report to authorities. I've worked with VVIP executive protection teams before and if the trip needs to be secret they will schedule plane swaps along the trip or rent a jet that is not attributable to the company.
- schmookeeg 6y ago
  The only time I would bother looking into your backyard would be if I was about to land off-airport into it.
tjohns 6y ago
ATC isn't the only party who needs to see the aircraft IDs. As a pilot, it's valuable to be able to see tail numbers to help correlate what I'm hearing on the radio with what I'm seeing on my displays. I can guess who's who from position reports, but seeing the tail number leaves no ambiguity. There are also some smaller facilities that use ADS-B to monitor traffic, but aren't networked into the national ATC radar system. Aviation events will also setup their own temporary control tower, and frequently use ADS-B as an aid for sequencing traffic. (Again, without access to the national ATC radar network.) For folks who need privacy, there are a couple options that already exist - UAT privacy mode or private Mode S addresses. Though notably, both of these are only available options for domestic flight within the US.
- t0mas88 6y ago
  Aircraft systems I know don't show the callsign of TCAS targets (although they should be able since it's in the extended mode S reply). I think only iPad based systems in small general aviation typically do that? I've never felt like I missed that information when flying.
Shakahs 6y ago
This isn’t a “lack of information security”, the whole point of transponders is the broadcast your aircraft identity and position. Having to coordinate with every ATC jurisdiction along a flight path would be extra work and leave room for errors. Additionally it wouldn’t work for flights that don’t have a planned route, like a civil aviation pilot who’s just cruising. It’s akin to having a license plate on your car.
- jjwiseman 6y ago
  It will work, it's called "Privacy ICAO Address" (PIA) by the FAA, and it's already being phased in: https://www.faa.gov/nextgen/equipadsb/privacy/ https://www.faa.gov/nextgen/equipadsb/privacy/

wrkronmiller 6y ago

> That wouldn't stop any traffic collision or ATC function from working but would prevent persistent tracking of for example private jets. I'm not sure how well that would work w/r/t ATC hand-off and their ability to look up flight plans. Furthermore, there's the problem of getting the random ID to ATC after the plane has "started up."

jjwiseman 6y ago
They're already doing this, but there's no reason for it to be a random ID—It's an ephemeral ID assigned by the FAA. So you know your ephemeral ID & registration, the FAA knows your ephemeral ID & registration, and while everyone else can see your ephemeral ID they do not know the aircraft registration it's tied to. https://www.faa.gov/nextgen/equipadsb/privacy/ https://www.faa.gov/nextgen/equipadsb/privacy/
- kortilla 6y ago
  An interesting image recognition project would be a camera watching departures from an airport that records the tail number of a plane and correlates it with the ephemeral ID to feed back into the exchange.

mike_d 6y ago

> would prevent persistent tracking of for example private jets Why? They are using our airspace. Looking down in to our backyards. I have a right to at least get an identifier I can use to report to authorities. I've worked with VVIP executive protection teams before and if the trip needs to be secret they will schedule plane swaps along the trip or rent a jet that is not attributable to the company.

schmookeeg 6y ago
The only time I would bother looking into your backyard would be if I was about to land off-airport into it.

tjohns 6y ago

ATC isn't the only party who needs to see the aircraft IDs. As a pilot, it's valuable to be able to see tail numbers to help correlate what I'm hearing on the radio with what I'm seeing on my displays. I can guess who's who from position reports, but seeing the tail number leaves no ambiguity. There are also some smaller facilities that use ADS-B to monitor traffic, but aren't networked into the national ATC radar system. Aviation events will also setup their own temporary control tower, and frequently use ADS-B as an aid for sequencing traffic. (Again, without access to the national ATC radar network.) For folks who need privacy, there are a couple options that already exist - UAT privacy mode or private Mode S addresses. Though notably, both of these are only available options for domestic flight within the US.

t0mas88 6y ago
Aircraft systems I know don't show the callsign of TCAS targets (although they should be able since it's in the extended mode S reply). I think only iPad based systems in small general aviation typically do that? I've never felt like I missed that information when flying.

Shakahs 6y ago

This isn’t a “lack of information security”, the whole point of transponders is the broadcast your aircraft identity and position. Having to coordinate with every ATC jurisdiction along a flight path would be extra work and leave room for errors. Additionally it wouldn’t work for flights that don’t have a planned route, like a civil aviation pilot who’s just cruising. It’s akin to having a license plate on your car.

jjwiseman 6y ago
It will work, it's called "Privacy ICAO Address" (PIA) by the FAA, and it's already being phased in: https://www.faa.gov/nextgen/equipadsb/privacy/ https://www.faa.gov/nextgen/equipadsb/privacy/