4 ms·

So possession is decriminalized but what about sale and distribution? Also is this in direct conflict with federal law prohibiting the same?

SV_BubbleTime 6y ago
Nothing is changed for federal law. if you were in Oregon and some federal agent catches you with drugs, you will be facing charges.
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onetimemanytime 6y ago
>>but what about sale and distribution? No El Chapo Shacks: "the state’s residents will no longer face arrests or prison sentences for carrying small amounts of drugs like cocaine, heroin, oxycontin and methamphetamine. "
- dahdum 6y ago
  This does mean dealers can hold small amounts for sale at lower risk than before. Portland is already pretty accepting of open air drug markets though, so in reality not much may change.
  - onetimemanytime 6y ago
    True, but cops know them and will wait till they have more than the limit. Or the narcs can be helpful and add a few grams....who's watching? :)
  - hajile 6y ago
    It means delivery boys won't be at risk, but someone along the line has to have a large supply or shipping costs become untenable. Since almost all the risk goes away, those delivery boys pay will drop drastically too. I wonder what effect that will have? I suspect like all organized crimee that they'll move on to other rackets.
    - dahdum 6y ago
      I think it's safe to assume that overall drug use won't go down under this policy, so while their rate may go down due to increased labor pool, earnings may still go up. Especially with pandemic fears still out there. I think the big impact will be sales through acquaintance/friend networks though, this will make it much easier to support an addiction through small sales. There'll be more money flowing to the traffickers so they're not going anywhere.
      - api_or_ipa 6y ago
        > I think it's safe to assume that overall drug use won't go down under this policy I don't exactly think people actively weigh the probability of punishment when considering to consume drugs. There's a wealth of research that suggests stiffer penalties don't dissuade drug use. If this is true, then the inverse is likely true. I also think it's fairly well understood that traffickers thrive best in an illegal marketplace, since the threat of violence and imprisonment is effectively a barrier to entry for people with less violent means. If the outcomes of marijuana legalization hold true for other drugs, we'll see more market participation from legal organizations and that additional market competition will drive the violent cartels into other unregulated markets where their competitive advantage in violence can be better leveraged. The takeaway is that violent cartels work best when they can exploit their advantage in violence. Take away that advantage by making the market legal, and you cut the economic legs out from those organizations.
        dahdum 6y ago
        I agree with you, but I don't think your takeaway applies here. This market remains highly illegal, it's just the final distribution layer and end user that have been decriminalized. I don't see that reducing demand anytime soon.
  - nosmokewhereiam 6y ago
    While pop ups do exist in Portland, it's really only for cannabis, sass, psilo, and maybe L. You'd be beat up if harder things were on your table. True yesterday, true today.
    - sushshshsh 6y ago
      Good to know that nobody will go to prison for neither the drugs nor the assault
ogre_codes 6y ago
> Also is this in direct conflict with federal law prohibiting the same? This is no different from marijuana legislation in multiple states which "legalizes" marijuana. Federal agencies can still enforce federal laws, but state & local law enforcement and judges enforce the state legislation. Federal agencies have somewhat limited jurisdiction in the states. I think there have been cases where people have been convicted of marijuana possession in states where it's legal.

SV_BubbleTime 6y ago

Nothing is changed for federal law. if you were in Oregon and some federal agent catches you with drugs, you will be facing charges.

deleted 6y ago
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onetimemanytime 6y ago

>>but what about sale and distribution? No El Chapo Shacks: "the state’s residents will no longer face arrests or prison sentences for carrying small amounts of drugs like cocaine, heroin, oxycontin and methamphetamine. "

dahdum 6y ago
This does mean dealers can hold small amounts for sale at lower risk than before. Portland is already pretty accepting of open air drug markets though, so in reality not much may change.
- onetimemanytime 6y ago
  True, but cops know them and will wait till they have more than the limit. Or the narcs can be helpful and add a few grams....who's watching? :)
- hajile 6y ago
  It means delivery boys won't be at risk, but someone along the line has to have a large supply or shipping costs become untenable. Since almost all the risk goes away, those delivery boys pay will drop drastically too. I wonder what effect that will have? I suspect like all organized crimee that they'll move on to other rackets.
  - dahdum 6y ago
    I think it's safe to assume that overall drug use won't go down under this policy, so while their rate may go down due to increased labor pool, earnings may still go up. Especially with pandemic fears still out there. I think the big impact will be sales through acquaintance/friend networks though, this will make it much easier to support an addiction through small sales. There'll be more money flowing to the traffickers so they're not going anywhere.
    - api_or_ipa 6y ago
      > I think it's safe to assume that overall drug use won't go down under this policy I don't exactly think people actively weigh the probability of punishment when considering to consume drugs. There's a wealth of research that suggests stiffer penalties don't dissuade drug use. If this is true, then the inverse is likely true. I also think it's fairly well understood that traffickers thrive best in an illegal marketplace, since the threat of violence and imprisonment is effectively a barrier to entry for people with less violent means. If the outcomes of marijuana legalization hold true for other drugs, we'll see more market participation from legal organizations and that additional market competition will drive the violent cartels into other unregulated markets where their competitive advantage in violence can be better leveraged. The takeaway is that violent cartels work best when they can exploit their advantage in violence. Take away that advantage by making the market legal, and you cut the economic legs out from those organizations.
      - dahdum 6y ago
        I agree with you, but I don't think your takeaway applies here. This market remains highly illegal, it's just the final distribution layer and end user that have been decriminalized. I don't see that reducing demand anytime soon.
- nosmokewhereiam 6y ago
  While pop ups do exist in Portland, it's really only for cannabis, sass, psilo, and maybe L. You'd be beat up if harder things were on your table. True yesterday, true today.
  - sushshshsh 6y ago
    Good to know that nobody will go to prison for neither the drugs nor the assault

ogre_codes 6y ago

> Also is this in direct conflict with federal law prohibiting the same? This is no different from marijuana legislation in multiple states which "legalizes" marijuana. Federal agencies can still enforce federal laws, but state & local law enforcement and judges enforce the state legislation. Federal agencies have somewhat limited jurisdiction in the states. I think there have been cases where people have been convicted of marijuana possession in states where it's legal.